Accents in spelling check

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Séamas Ó Brógáin-2 Séamas Ó Brógáin-2
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Accents in spelling check

I was dismayed to discover recently (and surprised that I never noticed
before) that Libre Office disregards the difference between, say, á and
a in spelling checks, and in find and replace. (Dismayed also to
imagine that someone thinks this is a good idea.)

I wonder if anyone knows how (or whether) I could fix this. Or perhaps
it’s not in Libre Office at all but in Hunspell, or otherwise deep down
in the system. I’ve done some searching but can’t find any relevant
information.

In case it matters, I’m using Libre Office 6.0.5.2 on Ubuntu Mate 18.04.

Many thanks for any help.

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TomD TomD
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Re: Accents in spelling check

On Thu, 2 Aug 2018 21:55 Séamas Ó Brógáin, <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I was dismayed to discover recently (and surprised that I never noticed
> before) that Libre Office disregards the difference between, say, á and
> a in spelling checks, and in find and replace. (Dismayed also to
> imagine that someone thinks this is a good idea.)
>
> I wonder if anyone knows how (or whether) I could fix this. Or perhaps
> it’s not in Libre Office at all but in Hunspell, or otherwise deep down
> in the system. I’ve done some searching but can’t find any relevant
> information.
>
> In case it matters, I’m using Libre Office 6.0.5.2 on Ubuntu Mate 18.04.
>
> Many thanks for any help.
>
> --
> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
> Problems?
> https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
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Robert Funnell Robert Funnell
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Re: Accents in spelling check

In reply to this post by Séamas Ó Brógáin-2
On Thu, 2 Aug 2018, Séamas Ó Brógáin wrote:

> I was dismayed to discover recently (and surprised that I never noticed
> before) that Libre Office disregards the difference between, say, á and
> a in spelling checks, and in find and replace. (Dismayed also to
> imagine that someone thinks this is a good idea.)

If I enter the string 'éeéeéeéeéeéeéeée' and do Find (or Find and
Replace) for either 'é' or 'e', it picks up only the appropriate form.
And if I enter the text 'hélp help', then 'hélp' is flagged by the
spell checker but 'help' is not. So I don't seem to be seeing what you
describe? I'm using LO 5.2.7.2 under Debian Linux with the language
set to English (Canada).

- Robert

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Krunose Krunose
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Re: Accents in spelling check

In reply to this post by Séamas Ó Brógáin-2
02.08.2018 u 22:54, Séamas Ó Brógáin je napisao/la:

> I was dismayed to discover recently (and surprised that I never noticed
> before) that Libre Office disregards the difference between, say, á and
> a in spelling checks, and in find and replace. (Dismayed also to
> imagine that someone thinks this is a good idea.)
>
> I wonder if anyone knows how (or whether) I could fix this. Or perhaps
> it’s not in Libre Office at all but in Hunspell, or otherwise deep down
> in the system. I’ve done some searching but can’t find any relevant
> information.
>
> In case it matters, I’m using Libre Office 6.0.5.2 on Ubuntu Mate 18.04.
>
> Many thanks for any help.
>

Well, there's a Hunspell's feature triggered by ICONV replacement table
but caveats exists.

For entry

ICONV á a

Hunspell - and LO as it uses Hunepll - will treat aáa the same as aaa
and it will not flag it as misspelled.

Letter á should be added into TRY section of Hunspell dictionary file
and words with á should make to wordlist so (possibly misspelled) aaa
could be corrected to aáa.

You can't get perfect recognition as that mean that every word in your
language should be added accented to your dictionary and that's
unbearable in terms of maintaining dictionary.

What you could to is add that ICONV replacement table into you
dictionary so accented words get ignored and aáa would not be flagged,
but for aáb you'll still get suggestion aaa when what you really wont is
aáa.

If words in your language in writing are not generally accented, than
you need to find a workaround. Accented letter is still a different
letter then regular (a ~ á) and Hunspell can't tell if it's a accent or
a letter. In Croatian c ~ č ~ ć and non of last two are accented and are
legit (potential) spelling mistakes.

Don't know if this helped.

Kruno

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Krunose Krunose
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Re: Accents in spelling check



03.08.2018 u 08:51, Krunose je napisao/la:

> 02.08.2018 u 22:54, Séamas Ó Brógáin je napisao/la:
>> I was dismayed to discover recently (and surprised that I never noticed
>> before) that Libre Office disregards the difference between, say, á and
>> a in spelling checks, and in find and replace. (Dismayed also to
>> imagine that someone thinks this is a good idea.)
>>
>> I wonder if anyone knows how (or whether) I could fix this. Or perhaps
>> it’s not in Libre Office at all but in Hunspell, or otherwise deep down
>> in the system. I’ve done some searching but can’t find any relevant
>> information.
>>
>> In case it matters, I’m using Libre Office 6.0.5.2 on Ubuntu Mate 18.04.
>>
>> Many thanks for any help.
>>
>
> Well, there's a Hunspell's feature triggered by ICONV replacement
> table but caveats exists.
>
> For entry
>
> ICONV á a
>
> Hunspell - and LO as it uses Hunepll - will treat aáa the same as aaa
> and it will not flag it as misspelled.
>
> Letter á should be added into TRY section of Hunspell dictionary file
> and words with á should make to wordlist so (possibly misspelled) aaa
> could be corrected to aáa.
>
> You can't get perfect recognition as that mean that every word in your
> language should be added accented to your dictionary and that's
> unbearable in terms of maintaining dictionary.
>
> What you could to is add that ICONV replacement table into you
> dictionary so accented words get ignored and aáa would not be flagged,
> but for aáb you'll still get suggestion aaa when what you really wont
> is aáa.
>
> If words in your language in writing are not generally accented, than
> you need to find a workaround. Accented letter is still a different
> letter then regular (a ~ á) and Hunspell can't tell if it's a accent
> or a letter. In Croatian c ~ č ~ ć and non of last two are accented
> and are legit (potential) spelling mistakes.
>
> Don't know if this helped.
>
> Kruno
>


Most reasonable solution is to locate dictionary on your system and add
ICONV replacement table as in

     https://github.com/krunose/hr-hunspell/blob/master/hr_HR.aff

so at least you don't get aáa flaged (gets ignored), but again, you
still get suggestion aaa if you misspell accented word: aáb > aaa when
you'd expect aáa.

Spelling checker is for writing regular texts and not designed for
highly technical linguistic text with lot of accents and other special
symbols.

Fell free to ask if you have any further questions, but this is best
possible solution (but workaround actually).

Kruno

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Séamas Ó Brógáin-2 Séamas Ó Brógáin-2
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Re: Accents in spelling check

In reply to this post by Krunose
Thank you, all.

The .aff file is somewhat outside my comfort zone, but I’ll certainly
experiment with it.

I may have caused some confusion with my use of the word “accents,”
which I used (for simplicity’s sake) instead of “diacritical marks.”
I’m concerned with words in which the acute accent is not a temporary
mark to show accent or stress but in which áéíóú are distinct letters,
not interchangeable with aeiou. Exchanging one for the other in such a
word is therefore a spelling error.

But I think Kruno has put me on the right track, and that the ICONV
feature in the .aff file is the place to start.

Míle buíochas!

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Krunose Krunose
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Re: Accents in spelling check



03.08.2018 u 11:29, Séamas Ó Brógáin je napisao/la:
> Thank you, all.
>
> The .aff file is somewhat outside my comfort zone, but I’ll certainly
> experiment with it.
>
> I may have caused some confusion with my use of the word “accents,”
> which I used (for simplicity’s sake) instead of “diacritical marks.”

> I’m concerned with words in which the acute accent is not a temporary
> mark to show accent or stress but in which áéíóú are distinct letters,
> not interchangeable with aeiou. Exchanging one for the other in such a
> word is therefore a spelling error.

In that case what you should to is check if áéíó are listed in TRY
section of .aff file (usually right at the top) and add any word you
need (which uses this letters) to .dic file as regular words (as in your
case that's what they really are).

For what I can see from your follow-up is that your dictionary is
missing some proper words and you have the same situation as with s ~ š,
z ~ ž, c ~ č ~ ć in Croatian. My previous answer was really concerning
accents.

Feel free to ask if you need any further advice or assistance.

Kruno



>
> But I think Kruno has put me on the right track, and that the ICONV
> feature in the .aff file is the place to start.
>
> Míle buíochas!
>


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Krunose Krunose
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Re: Accents in spelling check

03.08.2018 u 11:48, Krunose je napisao/la:

>
>
> 03.08.2018 u 11:29, Séamas Ó Brógáin je napisao/la:
>> Thank you, all.
>>
>> The .aff file is somewhat outside my comfort zone, but I’ll certainly
>> experiment with it.
>>
>> I may have caused some confusion with my use of the word “accents,”
>> which I used (for simplicity’s sake) instead of “diacritical marks.”
>
>> I’m concerned with words in which the acute accent is not a temporary
>> mark to show accent or stress but in which áéíóú are distinct letters,
>> not interchangeable with aeiou. Exchanging one for the other in such a
>> word is therefore a spelling error.
>
> In that case what you should to is check if áéíó are listed in TRY
> section of .aff file (usually right at the top) and add any word you
> need (which uses this letters) to .dic file as regular words (as in
> your case that's what they really are).
>
> For what I can see from your follow-up is that your dictionary is
> missing some proper words and you have the same situation as with s ~
> š, z ~ ž, c ~ č ~ ć in Croatian. My previous answer was really
> concerning accents.
>
> Feel free to ask if you need any further advice or assistance.
>
> Kruno


Just make sure you're not editing dictionary for one-time situation as
in that case my advice would be to just bare with it. If words you plan
to add are proper words in your language and you feel dictionary is not
complete in that regard, you should contact whoever is maintaining
dictionary for your language so it can be updated.

Kruno


>
>
>
>>
>> But I think Kruno has put me on the right track, and that the ICONV
>> feature in the .aff file is the place to start.
>>
>> Míle buíochas!
>>
>
>


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Séamas Ó Brógáin-2 Séamas Ó Brógáin-2
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Re: Accents in spelling check [SOLVED]

Well, I simply reinstalled a back-up .aff file that I had, and it seems
to work as it should (and as it did––I think). Perhaps I had a
corrupted .aff file.

But I’m intrigued by some of the options in the .aff file, and I intend
to go into it more deeply as soon as I get the time.

In the meantime, many thanks for all the help.


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