Nitpicking on a name

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Charles-H. Schulz Charles-H. Schulz
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Nitpicking on a name

Hello everyone,

I apologize as what I am writing about might seem like a detail to many, but I think it hurts a bit the project in the end to leave these things as they are.

On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.

Historically the people who did were long time OpenOffice.org users who were a bit skeptical of us at first and who felt necessary to "format"LibreOffice in a way they thought was easier.

Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...

Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean anything and sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not "hello", we are libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone here.

Thanks!

Charles.
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Peter Hillier-Brook Peter Hillier-Brook
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

Bravo!

On 25/07/14 08:19, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I apologize as what I am writing about might seem like a detail to
> many, but I think it hurts a bit the project in the end to leave
> these things as they are.
>
> On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call
> LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never
> called LibreOffice LO.
>
> Historically the people who did were long time OpenOffice.org users
> who were a bit skeptical of us at first and who felt necessary to
> "format"LibreOffice in a way they thought was easier.
>
> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with
> LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
>
> Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean
> anything and sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not
> "hello", we are libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone
> here.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Charles.
>


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Cley Faye Cley Faye
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
2014-07-25 9:19 GMT+02:00 Charles-H. Schulz <
[hidden email]>:

> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with
> LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...


​I've seen MSO used in long messages... Seeing that these messages are on
the *LibreOffice* mailing list, I doubt that there is any confusion
possible.

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Charles-H. Schulz Charles-H. Schulz
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

Hello Cley,

On 25 juillet 2014 11:17:42 CEST, Cley Faye <[hidden email]> wrote:

>2014-07-25 9:19 GMT+02:00 Charles-H. Schulz <
>[hidden email]>:
>
>> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with
>> LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
>
>
>​I've seen MSO used in long messages... Seeing that these messages are
>on
>the *LibreOffice* mailing list, I doubt that there is any confusion
>possible.


Oh, I am not afraid of confusion. Only that we are using a weird way to call LibreOffice and that it does not make much sense to use an acronym.

Best,

Charles.

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Owen Genat Owen Genat
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
Charles-H. Schulz wrote
On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.
Acronyms / nicknames / shortcuts are rarely at the discretion of the one being named. If the "O" in LibreOffice had been lowercase, then there /may/ have been a chance to prevent this, but that is long past now. People will shorten it as they can e.g., "LO", "LibO", LibreO", "LOffice", etc.

Charles-H. Schulz wrote
Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
OOo for OpenOffice.org, AOO for Apache OpenOffice, LO for LibreOffice, MSO for Microsoft Office are all acronyms I use, here on the mailing lists, at the AskLO site, and at the original support forum. Even the source code is filled with "lo" and "LO" (e.g., LO4Android) for the same reason. I am not meaning to be antagonistic by stating this, I am just presenting facts. What you are asking is akin to suggesting people refrain from using "MS" for Microsoft or "FB" for Facebook. The chance of success would seem improbably low.

Best wishes, Owen.
Paul Steyn Paul Steyn
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
On Fri, 25 Jul 2014 11:37:16 +0200
"Charles-H. Schulz" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Oh, I am not afraid of confusion. Only that we are using a weird way
> to call LibreOffice and that it does not make much sense to use an
> acronym.

With all due respect here, and not to shoot the messenger, but apart
from the possibility of confusion, I cannot see any other reason to
worry about this.

I don't think using acronyms or shortenings are "weird", I think they
are perfectly normal, and I see them all the time. "FB" for Facebook,
"MS" for Microsoft, "MSO", "AOO", "OOo", even "*nix". I've seen
Photoshop called PS before; the examples are many, and it seems to be
human nature to make things easier for ourselves. SMS texting
conventions like "b4" and "l8r" are the same thing, really, as are
things like "IANAL", "AIUI", and others.

Out in the wider world, one should be careful of just using "LO",
because people may well not know what one is talking about, so
confusion *is* a possibility, but I mostly see this used here on these
lists, where confusion is hardly likely.

One could argue that "LibO", say, is nicer, and probably clearer, so if
one was writing a more public review one might prefer that, but
it's probably a matter of taste, and, on this list especially, I hardly
think it matters.

My opinion, of course, just adding it to the pile...

Paul

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Jon Harringdon Jon Harringdon
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
"Charles-H. Schulz" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
>
> Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean anything and sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not "hello", we are libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone here.

-1.

I am completely new to the world of LO, OOo and the other variants
(still haven't the foggiest as to what is AOO and can't be bothered to
google it) although I am a long-term user of MS Office (which I
sometimes have been known to shorten to MSO).

However, I have absolutely no reason to stick with MS software; in fact,
I am actively trying to get way from them and the ONLY two principles
guiding this effort are 1) Is the replacement as capable as the stuff I
currently use? and 2) Is my long-term productivity at least the same as
it was with the stuff I currently use?

IOW, I am a 100% pragmatist and not in the least interested in the
"politics" of various FOSS proponents. You may not like that but that's
the way it is for many people.

Back to topic. It came natural to me to shorten LibreOffice to LO and
so, I assume, it'll be with others. Use (and abuse) of "nicknames" and
abbrev. is very rarely, if ever, in the domain of the person or "thing"
concerned. What's more, I am convinced that attempts to impose naming
conventions and suchlike will, in the long run, backfire.

As to "LO" vs "low", I have never even made that connection and I
actually feel it's faintly ridiculous to so. I think it'd be much better
to invest time and effort to make LO a better product, in itself and
also as far as the documentation and other "external bits" are concerned
than to waste time with ultimately fruitless naming discussions. IMHO,
YMMV etc.

I'll stick with LO for reasons of brevity.

Jon

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Charles-H. Schulz Charles-H. Schulz
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Paul Steyn
Le 25.07.2014 12:59, Paul a écrit :

> On Fri, 25 Jul 2014 11:37:16 +0200
> "Charles-H. Schulz" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Oh, I am not afraid of confusion. Only that we are using a weird way
>> to call LibreOffice and that it does not make much sense to use an
>> acronym.
>
> With all due respect here, and not to shoot the messenger, but apart
> from the possibility of confusion, I cannot see any other reason to
> worry about this.
>
> I don't think using acronyms or shortenings are "weird", I think they
> are perfectly normal, and I see them all the time. "FB" for Facebook,
> "MS" for Microsoft, "MSO", "AOO", "OOo", even "*nix". I've seen
> Photoshop called PS before; the examples are many, and it seems to be
> human nature to make things easier for ourselves. SMS texting
> conventions like "b4" and "l8r" are the same thing, really, as are
> things like "IANAL", "AIUI", and others.
>
> Out in the wider world, one should be careful of just using "LO",
> because people may well not know what one is talking about, so
> confusion *is* a possibility, but I mostly see this used here on these
> lists, where confusion is hardly likely.
>
> One could argue that "LibO", say, is nicer, and probably clearer, so if
> one was writing a more public review one might prefer that, but
> it's probably a matter of taste, and, on this list especially, I hardly
> think it matters.
>
> My opinion, of course, just adding it to the pile...


Actually you are making quite a good point; "LO" is used here -again
mostly, and oddly- likely only on this list. So yes indeed, if we are
careful (and we should be) not to use that acronym in the "wider world",
this list is the one primarily used for and by users. Some of them are
completely new, and as such it is their first interaction with the
Libreoffice community.
We would not want to use "LO" with new users then.

Some may find the use of "LO" as a convenience, but convenience can
often be the ennemy of excellence; especially in this case when only
used by a small fraction of the community.

Cheers,

Charles.



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Stefan Weigel-2 Stefan Weigel-2
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
Hi Charles,

Am 25.07.2014 um 09:19 schrieb Charles-H. Schulz:
> Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean
> anything and sends the wrong message.

From my personal observation LO is a well established abbreviation
for LibreOffice as well as AOO, OOo, MSO are well-known
abbreviations for other products.

As a kind of proof at least in german:

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/LO

;-)

Stefan

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doug-2 doug-2
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz

On 07/25/2014 03:19 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I apologize as what I am writing about might seem like a detail to many, but I think it hurts a bit the project in the end to leave these things as they are.
>
> On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.
>
> Historically the people who did were long time OpenOffice.org users who were a bit skeptical of us at first and who felt necessary to "format"LibreOffice in a way they thought was easier.
>
> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
>
> Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean anything and sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not "hello", we are libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone here.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Charles.
You guys are lucky that anybody uses your French-named program. If the
guys in the distros didn't get PO'd at Open Office, you wouldn't even
exist! And if the
distros started putting OO in their defaults instead of LO you'd be out
of business. What a dumb thing to bitch about!

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krackedpress krackedpress
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Peter Hillier-Brook

I never us "LO" outside of these lists.  Well except maybe a DVD volume
title like "LO-NA-DVD-4.2.5", which needs abbreviations to fit
everything in.

When abbreviations are "allowed" or needed, then I use LO, OOo, AOO,
MSO, and things like that.

On 07/25/2014 05:10 AM, Peter Hillier-Brook wrote:

> Bravo!
>
> On 25/07/14 08:19, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I apologize as what I am writing about might seem like a detail to
>> many, but I think it hurts a bit the project in the end to leave
>> these things as they are.
>>
>> On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call
>> LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never
>> called LibreOffice LO.
>>
>> Historically the people who did were long time OpenOffice.org users
>> who were a bit skeptical of us at first and who felt necessary to
>> "format"LibreOffice in a way they thought was easier.
>>
>> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with
>> LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
>>
>> Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean
>> anything and sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not
>> "hello", we are libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone
>> here.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Charles.
>>
>


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anne-ology anne-ology
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
       "silly is as silly does" this is not;
            rather inane, bordering on insane  ;-)

       OpenOffice was referred to as OO ...
           LibreOffice was an offshoot of this thus LO.

       [and yes, I have used this program since the days of OO.]

       BTW - Microsoft is properly abbreviated as MsFt -
          check any financial paper if you disbelieve.

       MS stands for Multiple Sclerosis; which is a crippling disease which
some folks have -
          [and yes, I know some who do have this disease]
         therefore to use this acronym for other things seems to be a slap
in the face to these disabled folks.



From: Charles-H. Schulz <[hidden email]>
Date: Fri, Jul 25, 2014 at 2:19 AM
Subject: [libreoffice-users] Nitpicking on a name
To: [hidden email]


Hello everyone,

I apologize as what I am writing about might seem like a detail to many,
but I think it hurts a bit the project in the end to leave these things as
they are.

On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call
LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never called
LibreOffice LO.

Historically the people who did were long time OpenOffice.org users who
were a bit skeptical of us at first and who felt necessary to
"format"LibreOffice in a way they thought was easier.

Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with
LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...

Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean anything and
sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not "hello", we are
libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone here.

Thanks!
Charles.

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libreoffice-ml.mbourne libreoffice-ml.mbourne
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

I'd always seen "LO" as being simply an abbreviation for "LibreOffice"
in the same way that "OOo" was an abbreviation of "OpenOffice.org". I'd
never associated it with any suggestion that LibreOffice is lo(w) quality.

As for MS, a single acronym can have many different meanings. It's one
of the problems with using them out of context (TLAs - that's Two/Three
Letter Acronyms, not Texas Library Association - are particularly overused).

The financial papers may well abbreviate Microsoft in one way, but
that's not to say it's the only way. From a quick look, MSFT is used as
an abbreviation for Microsoft, at least on NASDAQ - where MS is also
used, but for Morgan Stanley.

MS is a common abbreviation for Microsoft (yes, and Multiple Sclerosis,
and many other things). http://www.acronymfinder.com/MS.html lists 230
meanings for "MS", the first of which is Microsoft.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS also lists several possible meanings for
MS, again including Microsoft.

So MS has a different assumed meaning depending on the context. If
you're talking about computer software, MS may mean Microsoft, if you're
talking about finance it may mean Morgan Stanley, or if you're talking
about medical conditions it may be Multiple Sclerosis. Nothing to say
any of those uses are an offence to any other.

Mark.


anne-ology wrote:

>         "silly is as silly does" this is not;
>              rather inane, bordering on insane  ;-)
>
>         OpenOffice was referred to as OO ...
>             LibreOffice was an offshoot of this thus LO.
>
>         [and yes, I have used this program since the days of OO.]
>
>         BTW - Microsoft is properly abbreviated as MsFt -
>            check any financial paper if you disbelieve.
>
>         MS stands for Multiple Sclerosis; which is a crippling disease which
> some folks have -
>            [and yes, I know some who do have this disease]
>           therefore to use this acronym for other things seems to be a slap
> in the face to these disabled folks.
>
>
>
> From: Charles-H. Schulz <[hidden email]>
> Date: Fri, Jul 25, 2014 at 2:19 AM
> Subject: [libreoffice-users] Nitpicking on a name
> To: [hidden email]
>
>
> Hello everyone,
>
> I apologize as what I am writing about might seem like a detail to many,
> but I think it hurts a bit the project in the end to leave these things as
> they are.
>
> On this list (a few others as well but esp. On this one) people call
> LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my founder's hat here- never called
> LibreOffice LO.
>
> Historically the people who did were long time OpenOffice.org users who
> were a bit skeptical of us at first and who felt necessary to
> "format"LibreOffice in a way they thought was easier.
>
> Now you will tell me that it is easier to type LO than it is with
> LibreOffice. Perhaps. But everyone here writes MS Office...
>
> Anyway the point I am trying to make is that LO does not mean anything and
> sends the wrong message. We are not "low" , we are not "hello", we are
> libre people. Ans when I say we I lean everyone here.
>
> Thanks!
> Charles.
>

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pikov22 pikov22
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by anne-ology
anne-ology wrote on 7/27/2014 3:18 PM:

>        "silly is as silly does" this is not;
>             rather inane, bordering on insane  ;-)
>
>        OpenOffice was referred to as OO ...
>            LibreOffice was an offshoot of this thus LO.
>
>        [and yes, I have used this program since the days of OO.]
>
>        BTW - Microsoft is properly abbreviated as MsFt -
>           check any financial paper if you disbelieve.
>
>        MS stands for Multiple Sclerosis; which is a crippling disease which
> some folks have -
>           [and yes, I know some who do have this disease]
>          therefore to use this acronym for other things seems to be a slap
> in the face to these disabled folks.

I really think you have to consider the context where LO or MS is used.
Both LO and MS stand for many things.


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Urmas D. Urmas D.
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
"Charles-H. Schulz":

> On this list people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my
> founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.

Right, you have fixed all the bugs, got a functional parity with Microsoft
Word 2.0, and have a chance to bitch about the acronym. Cheers.



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Charles-H. Schulz Charles-H. Schulz
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

Le 27.07.2014 23:46, Urmas a écrit :
> "Charles-H. Schulz":
>
>> On this list people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my
>> founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.
>
> Right, you have fixed all the bugs, got a functional parity with
> Microsoft Word 2.0, and have a chance to bitch about the acronym.
> Cheers.

Absolutely, I do have that chance. Only an absolute moron who hides his
or her own name behind pseudos like you to insult people can think that
a software can have all of its bugs fixed. As for the feature parity
with Word 2.0, we have obviously passed that stage before OpenOffice.org
1.0; and if it was so easy, if it is that easy, why don't you go start
your own office suite and leave everyone else alone? What pleasure do
you take out of insulting people? Are you that much of a pervert, are
you that much lonely and screwed up that you can spend that much time
around here bitching against the software and the people around it? How
about looking for a solution to your own problems, to the very fact that
you are in such pain and misery that you use a pseudo to go around and
insult people online? Your life must be a terrible experience and you
have better to do than lingering around here, so STFU.

Charles.

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Felmon Davis Felmon Davis
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:

> Le 27.07.2014 23:46, Urmas a écrit :
>> "Charles-H. Schulz":
>>
>>> On this list people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my
>>> founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.
>>
>> Right, you have fixed all the bugs, got a functional parity with
>> Microsoft Word 2.0, and have a chance to bitch about the acronym.
>> Cheers.
>
> Absolutely, I do have that chance. Only an absolute moron who hides
> his or her own name behind pseudos like you to insult people can
> think that a software can have all of its bugs fixed. As for the
> feature parity with Word 2.0, we have obviously passed that stage
> before OpenOffice.org 1.0; and if it was so easy, if it is that
> easy, why don't you go start your own office suite and leave
> everyone else alone? What pleasure do you take out of insulting
> people? Are you that much of a pervert, are you that much lonely and
> screwed up that you can spend that much time around here bitching
> against the software and the people around it? How about looking for
> a solution to your own problems, to the very fact that you are in
> such pain and misery that you use a pseudo to go around and insult
> people online? Your life must be a terrible experience and you have
> better to do than lingering around here, so STFU.
>
> Charles.
>
>

gentlemen, I suggest this discussion be taken off-list where you can
pursue it much more effectively.

F.

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Felmon Davis

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  How can I miss you if you won't go away?
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krackedpress krackedpress
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

On 07/28/2014 09:41 AM, Felmon Davis wrote:

> On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
>
>> Le 27.07.2014 23:46, Urmas a écrit :
>>> "Charles-H. Schulz":
>>>
>>>> On this list people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my
>>>> founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.
>>>
>>> Right, you have fixed all the bugs, got a functional parity with
>>> Microsoft Word 2.0, and have a chance to bitch about the acronym.
>>> Cheers.
>>
>> Absolutely, I do have that chance. Only an absolute moron who hides
>> his or her own name behind pseudos like you to insult people can
>> think that a software can have all of its bugs fixed. As for the
>> feature parity with Word 2.0, we have obviously passed that stage
>> before OpenOffice.org 1.0; and if it was so easy, if it is that easy,
>> why don't you go start your own office suite and leave everyone else
>> alone? What pleasure do you take out of insulting people? Are you
>> that much of a pervert, are you that much lonely and screwed up that
>> you can spend that much time around here bitching against the
>> software and the people around it? How about looking for a solution
>> to your own problems, to the very fact that you are in such pain and
>> misery that you use a pseudo to go around and insult people online?
>> Your life must be a terrible experience and you have better to do
>> than lingering around here, so STFU.
>>
>> Charles.
>>
>>
>
> gentlemen, I suggest this discussion be taken off-list where you can
> pursue it much more effectively.
>
> F.
>

Could this be moved to the "discuss" list?
I would like to see where this is going, but not on the user list.

Tim L.
[a good number of you know my real name instead of my different "pseudo"
emails I use for different lists, here and "out on the net".]


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Charles-H. Schulz Charles-H. Schulz
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

Hello Tim, everyone,

Le 28.07.2014 16:09, Kracked_P_P---webmaster a écrit :

> On 07/28/2014 09:41 AM, Felmon Davis wrote:
>> On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
>>
>>> Le 27.07.2014 23:46, Urmas a écrit :
>>>> "Charles-H. Schulz":
>>>>
>>>>> On this list people call LibreOffice "LO". We -sorry to take on my
>>>>> founder's hat here- never called LibreOffice LO.
>>>>
>>>> Right, you have fixed all the bugs, got a functional parity with
>>>> Microsoft Word 2.0, and have a chance to bitch about the acronym.
>>>> Cheers.
>>>
>>> Absolutely, I do have that chance. Only an absolute moron who hides
>>> his or her own name behind pseudos like you to insult people can
>>> think that a software can have all of its bugs fixed. As for the
>>> feature parity with Word 2.0, we have obviously passed that stage
>>> before OpenOffice.org 1.0; and if it was so easy, if it is that easy,
>>> why don't you go start your own office suite and leave everyone else
>>> alone? What pleasure do you take out of insulting people? Are you
>>> that much of a pervert, are you that much lonely and screwed up that
>>> you can spend that much time around here bitching against the
>>> software and the people around it? How about looking for a solution
>>> to your own problems, to the very fact that you are in such pain and
>>> misery that you use a pseudo to go around and insult people online?
>>> Your life must be a terrible experience and you have better to do
>>> than lingering around here, so STFU.
>>>
>>> Charles.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> gentlemen, I suggest this discussion be taken off-list where you can
>> pursue it much more effectively.
>>
>> F.
>>
>
> Could this be moved to the "discuss" list?
> I would like to see where this is going, but not on the user list.

I do not think that we need to have this moved to the discuss list;
there was a perfectly normal and courteous thread that was interrupted
by the person using the pseudo "Urmas" who started to insult me, as
he/she has done repeatedly against many people here. I am happy to see
the courteous side of this thread continue, if needed, here. As for
myself, I'm done with this topic.

Best,

Charles.


>
> Tim L.
> [a good number of you know my real name instead of my different
> "pseudo" emails I use for different lists, here and "out on the net".]

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Urmas D. Urmas D.
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Re: Nitpicking on a name

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz
A lout known as "Charles-H. Schulz":

> As for the feature parity with Word 2.0, we have obviously passed that
stage before OpenOffice.org 1.0;

And yet it was not until 4.3, not yet released BTW your suit got support for
paragraphs longer than 64k or tagging the text with a language.

> and if it was so easy, if it is that easy, why don't you go start your own
> office suite and leave everyone else alone?

_You_'ve got 90% of your office suit for free from StarDivision (with German
comments
included), and it is _you_ who cannot develop it properly.

> What pleasure do you take out of insulting people?

It is you who are insulting people.



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