Open pps as ppt

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Mihai Dobrescu Mihai Dobrescu
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Open pps as ppt

Hello,

I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't remember hoe I set
it to open .pps files as they were .ppt.
How could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps files in
edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without changing the
extension?

Thanks,
Mihai Sorin Dobrescu

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David Griffiths David Griffiths
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Re: Open pps as ppt

Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:

>
> Hello,
>
> I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't remember hoe I set
> it to open .pps files as they were .ppt.
> How could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps files in
> edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without changing the
> extension?
>
> Thanks,
> Mihai Sorin Dobrescu
>
Hi Mihai,

If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in impress without
issue.

Regards

Dave




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Mihai Dobrescu Mihai Dobrescu
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Re: Open pps as ppt

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't remember hoe I
> set
> > it to open .pps files as they were .ppt.
> > How could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps files in
> > edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without changing the
> > extension?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mihai Sorin Dobrescu
> >
> Hi Mihai,
>
> If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in impress
> without
> issue.
>
> Regards
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
> --
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>
> Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming. An
option or parameter.

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Tom Tom
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Re: Open pps as ppt

HI :)  Have you tried the obvious
1. just double-click on the file
2. Right click and choose "Open with ... " (might be in "Properties" on that
right-click menu) and choose LibreOffice or Impress in there
3. In LibreOffice's Impress go up to the menus and click on
File - Open
and navigate to the file.
Regards from
Tom :)




________________________________
From: Mihai Dobrescu <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Wed, 9 February, 2011 10:01:33
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Open pps as ppt

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't remember hoe I
> set
> > it to open .pps files as they were .ppt.
> > How could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps files in
> > edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without changing the
> > extension?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mihai Sorin Dobrescu
> >
> Hi Mihai,
>
> If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in impress
> without
> issue.
>
> Regards
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/users/
> *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
>
> Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming. An
option or parameter.

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David Griffiths David Griffiths
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Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Mihai Dobrescu
Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:

>
> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths
><dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
> > wrote:
>
> > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming. An
> option or parameter.
>

Ok, try this from the command line:

libreoffice -show presentation.pps. According to the linux man
entry this should play the presentation then retrun to the edit
mode.

man libreoffice provides a description of all command line
switches.

Regards

Dave





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Mihai Dobrescu Mihai Dobrescu
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Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Tom
Yes, I did. It plays the presentation, then closes.

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 12:14 PM, Tom Davies <[hidden email]> wrote:

> HI :)  Have you tried the obvious
> 1. just double-click on the file
> 2. Right click and choose "Open with ... " (might be in "Properties" on
> that
> right-click menu) and choose LibreOffice or Impress in there
> 3. In LibreOffice's Impress go up to the menus and click on
> File - Open
> and navigate to the file.
> Regards from
> Tom :)
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Mihai Dobrescu <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Wed, 9 February, 2011 10:01:33
> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Open pps as ppt
>
> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths <
> [hidden email]
> > wrote:
>
> > Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
> >
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't remember hoe I
> > set
> > > it to open .pps files as they were .ppt.
> > > How could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps files
> in
> > > edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without changing the
> > > extension?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Mihai Sorin Dobrescu
> > >
> > Hi Mihai,
> >
> > If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in impress
> > without
> > issue.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/users/
> > *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
> >
> > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming. An
> option or parameter.
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
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>
>
>
>
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>

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Mihai Dobrescu Mihai Dobrescu
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Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by David Griffiths
There is no libreoffice executable on Windows.
I have tried simpress -show p.pps and it opens it, plays it and closes.
I couldn't find any useful switch.

I am sure it is an option somewhere.

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 12:42 PM, David Griffiths <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths
> ><dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming. An
> > option or parameter.
> >
>
> Ok, try this from the command line:
>
> libreoffice -show presentation.pps. According to the linux man
> entry this should play the presentation then retrun to the edit
> mode.
>
> man libreoffice provides a description of all command line
> switches.
>
> Regards
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/users/
> *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
>
>

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Charles Marcus Charles Marcus
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Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Mihai Dobrescu
On 2011-02-10 5:41 AM, Mihai Dobrescu wrote:

> From: Mihai Dobrescu <[hidden email]>
>> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths <
>> [hidden email]
>>> wrote:
>>> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>>>> I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't
>>>> remember hoe I set it to open .pps files as they were .ppt. How
>>>> could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps
>>>> files in edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without
>>>> changing the extension?

>>> If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in impress
>>> without
>>> issue.

>> HI :)  Have you tried the obvious
>> 1. just double-click on the file
>> 2. Right click and choose "Open with ... " (might be in "Properties"
>> on that right-click menu) and choose LibreOffice or Impress in there
>> 3. In LibreOffice's Impress go up to the menus and click on
>> File - Open and navigate to the file.

> Yes, I did. It plays the presentation, then closes.

Just change the extension from .pps to .ppt...

Also, please don't top-post in an already bottom/inline posted thread,
it totally screws up quoting...

--

Best regards,

Charles

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David Griffiths David Griffiths
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Re: Open pps as ppt

Charles Marcus <CMarcus <at> Media-Brokers.com> writes:

>
> On 2011-02-10 5:41 AM, Mihai Dobrescu wrote:
> > From: Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com>
> >> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths <
> >> dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
> >>> wrote:
> >>> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
> >>>> I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't
> >>>> remember hoe I set it to open .pps files as they were .ppt. How
> >>>> could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps
> >>>> files in edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without
> >>>> changing the extension?
>
> >>> If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in impress
> >>> without
> >>> issue.
>
> >> HI :)  Have you tried the obvious
> >> 1. just double-click on the file
> >> 2. Right click and choose "Open with ... " (might be in "Properties"
> >> on that right-click menu) and choose LibreOffice or Impress in there
> >> 3. In LibreOffice's Impress go up to the menus and click on
> >> File - Open and navigate to the file.
>
> > Yes, I did. It plays the presentation, then closes.
>
> Just change the extension from .pps to .ppt...
>
> Also, please don't top-post in an already bottom/inline posted thread,
> it totally screws up quoting...
>

Hi Charles,

I already suggested this a while ago to Mihai, but he does not want to
change the extension. The man page for LO suggests that the -show
option should play the slideshow then revert to editing. I tried today,
but it only plays the slideshow, then closes the application. In your
opinion is this a bug that needs raising? Personally I have no issue
with changing the extension, it works :-)

Best regards
Dave




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Cley Faye Cley Faye
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Re: Open pps as ppt

If it's working as originally intended it wouldn't classify as a bug, but it
can be a good feature request, to add another switch to open them in editing
regardless of the extension.
Le 10 févr. 2011 16:15, "David Griffiths" <[hidden email]> a
écrit :

> Charles Marcus <CMarcus <at> Media-Brokers.com> writes:
>
>>
>> On 2011-02-10 5:41 AM, Mihai Dobrescu wrote:
>> > From: Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com>
>> >> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths <
>> >> dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>> >>>> I have installed OpenOffice about two years ago. I don't
>> >>>> remember hoe I set it to open .pps files as they were .ppt. How
>> >>>> could I get that in my brand new LibreOffice - to open .pps
>> >>>> files in edit mode instead of running the slideshow and without
>> >>>> changing the extension?
>>
>> >>> If you rename the file from .pps to .ppt it opens for editing in
impress

>> >>> without
>> >>> issue.
>>
>> >> HI :) Have you tried the obvious
>> >> 1. just double-click on the file
>> >> 2. Right click and choose "Open with ... " (might be in "Properties"
>> >> on that right-click menu) and choose LibreOffice or Impress in there
>> >> 3. In LibreOffice's Impress go up to the menus and click on
>> >> File - Open and navigate to the file.
>>
>> > Yes, I did. It plays the presentation, then closes.
>>
>> Just change the extension from .pps to .ppt...
>>
>> Also, please don't top-post in an already bottom/inline posted thread,
>> it totally screws up quoting...
>>
>
> Hi Charles,
>
> I already suggested this a while ago to Mihai, but he does not want to
> change the extension. The man page for LO suggests that the -show
> option should play the slideshow then revert to editing. I tried today,
> but it only plays the slideshow, then closes the application. In your
> opinion is this a bug that needs raising? Personally I have no issue
> with changing the extension, it works :-)
>
> Best regards
> Dave
>
>
>
>
> --
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>

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Charles Marcus Charles Marcus
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Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by David Griffiths
On 2011-02-10 10:14 AM, David Griffiths wrote:
> I already suggested this a while ago to Mihai, but he does not want to
> change the extension.

Sorry, I missed that...

I just tested, and if I right-click, 'Open with...', then choose
'LibreOffice 3.3' - NOT 'LibreOffice Impress' - it just opens it for
editing...

--

Best regards,

Charles

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Harold Fuchs Harold Fuchs
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Re: Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Mihai Dobrescu

"Mihai Dobrescu" <[hidden email]> wrote in message
news:AANLkTim7ynP0JKeb0sWyN0D=[hidden email]...

> There is no libreoffice executable on Windows.
> I have tried simpress -show p.pps and it opens it, plays it and closes.
> I couldn't find any useful switch.
>
> I am sure it is an option somewhere.
>
> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 12:42 PM, David Griffiths
> <[hidden email]
>> wrote:
>
>> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>>
>> >
>> > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths
>> ><dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
>> > > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming.
>> > > An
>> > option or parameter.
>> >
>>

<snip>

I think that if you change the *File Association* for .pps files from
simpress.exe to soffice.exe then, after that change (which you only need to
do once), all .pps files will be opened in Edit mode. See Windows's Help for
details of how to change File Associations.

--
Harold Fuchs
London, England



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Tinkerer Tinkerer
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Re: Re: Open pps as ppt

Harold Fuchs wrote
"Mihai Dobrescu" <msdobrescu@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:AANLkTim7ynP0JKeb0sWyN0D=nK4WqzjDNmvyROTJRG3C@mail.gmail.com...
> There is no libreoffice executable on Windows.
> I have tried simpress -show p.pps and it opens it, plays it and closes.
> I couldn't find any useful switch.
>
> I am sure it is an option somewhere.
>
> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 12:42 PM, David Griffiths
> <dave.griffiths62@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>
>> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>>
>> >
>> > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths
>> ><dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
>> > > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming.
>> > > An
>> > option or parameter.
>> >
>>

<snip>

I think that if you change the *File Association* for .pps files from
simpress.exe to soffice.exe then, after that change (which you only need to
do once), all .pps files will be opened in Edit mode. See Windows's Help for
details of how to change File Associations.

--
Harold Fuchs
London, England



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I am using an iMac 10.6.6 and Libre 3.3.0.4
If I try the Open With route it runs.
To get into Edit Mode I press escape.
I have no problem with that.
Mihai Dobrescu Mihai Dobrescu
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Re: Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Harold Fuchs
On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 7:29 PM, Harold Fuchs <[hidden email]>wrote:

>
> "Mihai Dobrescu" <[hidden email]> wrote in message
> news:AANLkTim7ynP0JKeb0sWyN0D=[hidden email]...
>
>  There is no libreoffice executable on Windows.
>> I have tried simpress -show p.pps and it opens it, plays it and closes.
>> I couldn't find any useful switch.
>>
>> I am sure it is an option somewhere.
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 12:42 PM, David Griffiths <
>> [hidden email]
>>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>
>>  Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
>>>
>>> >
>>> > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths
>>> ><dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
>>> > > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without renaming.
>>> > > An
>>> > option or parameter.
>>> >
>>>
>>>
> <snip>
>
> I think that if you change the *File Association* for .pps files from
> simpress.exe to soffice.exe then, after that change (which you only need to
> do once), all .pps files will be opened in Edit mode. See Windows's Help for
> details of how to change File Associations.
>
> --
> Harold Fuchs
> London, England
>
>
> --
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>

Thanks,

but in my case (LibreOffice 3.3.0.4) it doesn't make the difference. It
plays the presentation, then closes as always.

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Re: Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Tinkerer
On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 9:23 PM, Tinkerer <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> Harold Fuchs wrote:
> >
> >
> > "Mihai Dobrescu" <[hidden email]> wrote in message
> > news:AANLkTim7ynP0JKeb0sWyN0D=[hidden email]...
> >> There is no libreoffice executable on Windows.
> >> I have tried simpress -show p.pps and it opens it, plays it and closes.
> >> I couldn't find any useful switch.
> >>
> >> I am sure it is an option somewhere.
> >>
> >> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 12:42 PM, David Griffiths
> >> <[hidden email]
> >>> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Mihai Dobrescu <msdobrescu <at> gmail.com> writes:
> >>>
> >>> >
> >>> > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 11:15 AM, David Griffiths
> >>> ><dave.griffiths62 <at> gmail.com
> >>> > > wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> > > Thanks, but no thanks. It worked before. I need it without
> renaming.
> >>> > > An
> >>> > option or parameter.
> >>> >
> >>>
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > I think that if you change the *File Association* for .pps files from
> > simpress.exe to soffice.exe then, after that change (which you only need
> > to
> > do once), all .pps files will be opened in Edit mode. See Windows's Help
> > for
> > details of how to change File Associations.
> >
> > --
> > Harold Fuchs
> > London, England
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/users/
> > *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
> >
> >
> I am using an iMac 10.6.6 and Libre 3.3.0.4
> If I try the Open With route it runs.
> To get into Edit Mode I press escape.
> I have no problem with that.
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Open-pps-as-ppt-tp2457168p2468287.html
> Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> --
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>
>
On Windows 7 64 bit it closes when I press Esc.

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Mihai Dobrescu Mihai Dobrescu
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Re: Open pps as ppt

In reply to this post by Charles Marcus
On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 5:41 PM, Charles Marcus
<[hidden email]>wrote:

> On 2011-02-10 10:14 AM, David Griffiths wrote:
> > I already suggested this a while ago to Mihai, but he does not want to
> > change the extension.
>
> Sorry, I missed that...
>
> I just tested, and if I right-click, 'Open with...', then choose
> 'LibreOffice 3.3' - NOT 'LibreOffice Impress' - it just opens it for
> editing...
>
> --
>
> Best regards,
>
> Charles
>
> --
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>
>
Sorry, I don't understand the 'LibreOffice 3.3' - NOT 'LibreOffice Impress'
part.

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Stefano Fraccaro Stefano Fraccaro
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Excel - Calc file locking

In reply to this post by Tinkerer
Hi,
     I have strange behaviour with file locking when xls file are
accessed by LibreOffice and Excel.
Situation:

    * user A with Excel 2000
    * user B with LibreOffice 3.3 / OpenOffice 3.2

Step to reproduce:

    * user A open, modify,save and close "example.xml" file with Excel 2000
    * user B open "example.xml" with LibreOffice 3.3
    * user A open "example.xml" and Excel tell the user that file is
      opened by user A (expected: user B)
    * user A open "example.xml" with LibreOffice and the program tell
      the user that file is opened by user B (as expected)


Users may be confused by this messages. Is a bug or a well know behaviour?

Stefano Fraccaro

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Tom Tom
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Re: Excel - Calc file locking

Hi :)

This seems to be normal behaviour.  The first person to open the document should
be able to edit it.  If the document is then opened a 2nd and 3rd (or more) time
then it can only be edited by the 1st one.  The other people can open it as
"read only".

If everyone could edit the same cells at the same time then there might be some
confusion about which edit to keep because there are a lot of contradictory
'obvious' answers.

It might be worth trying to open the document in google-docs a number of times
and see how it gets handled there.
Good luck and regards from
Tom :)





________________________________
From: Stefano Fraccaro <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Fri, 11 February, 2011 9:08:34
Subject: [libreoffice-users] Excel - Calc file locking

Hi,
    I have strange behaviour with file locking when xls file are accessed by
LibreOffice and Excel.
Situation:

   * user A with Excel 2000
   * user B with LibreOffice 3.3 / OpenOffice 3.2

Step to reproduce:

   * user A open, modify,save and close "example.xml" file with Excel 2000
   * user B open "example.xml" with LibreOffice 3.3
   * user A open "example.xml" and Excel tell the user that file is
     opened by user A (expected: user B)
   * user A open "example.xml" with LibreOffice and the program tell
     the user that file is opened by user B (as expected)


Users may be confused by this messages. Is a bug or a well know behaviour?

Stefano Fraccaro

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Luuk Luuk
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Re: Excel - Calc file locking

On 11-02-11 10:56, Tom Davies wrote:
> Hi :)
>
> This seems to be normal behaviour.  The first person to open the document should
> be able to edit it.  If the document is then opened a 2nd and 3rd (or more) time
> then it can only be edited by the 1st one.  The other people can open it as
> "read only".
>
When reading previous message Excel does behave in a different way than
Calc does.


> If everyone could edit the same cells at the same time then there might be some
> confusion about which edit to keep because there are a lot of contradictory
> 'obvious' answers.

It is possible, in Excel, to share documents.
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/excel-help/about-shared-workbooks-HP005262294.aspx



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Windows10 / LibreOffice  (latest?)
Stefano Fraccaro Stefano Fraccaro
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Re: Excel - Calc file locking

In reply to this post by Tom
Hi Tom,
     you are right but this is not the problem... the problem is that I
don't know who have the file opened at this time (I can tell my collegue
to close the file)! Excel users see last Excel user that have used the
file, LibreOffice users see unknown user... expected result is available
only if all users use Excel or LibreOffice (not mixed environment).


Il 11/02/2011 10.56, Tom Davies ha scritto:

> Hi :)
>
> This seems to be normal behaviour.  The first person to open the document should
> be able to edit it.  If the document is then opened a 2nd and 3rd (or more) time
> then it can only be edited by the 1st one.  The other people can open it as
> "read only".
>
> If everyone could edit the same cells at the same time then there might be some
> confusion about which edit to keep because there are a lot of contradictory
> 'obvious' answers.
>
> It might be worth trying to open the document in google-docs a number of times
> and see how it gets handled there.
> Good luck and regards from
> Tom :)
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Stefano Fraccaro<[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Fri, 11 February, 2011 9:08:34
> Subject: [libreoffice-users] Excel - Calc file locking
>
> Hi,
>      I have strange behaviour with file locking when xls file are accessed by
> LibreOffice and Excel.
> Situation:
>
>     * user A with Excel 2000
>     * user B with LibreOffice 3.3 / OpenOffice 3.2
>
> Step to reproduce:
>
>     * user A open, modify,save and close "example.xml" file with Excel 2000
>     * user B open "example.xml" with LibreOffice 3.3
>     * user A open "example.xml" and Excel tell the user that file is
>       opened by user A (expected: user B)
>     * user A open "example.xml" with LibreOffice and the program tell
>       the user that file is opened by user B (as expected)
>
>
> Users may be confused by this messages. Is a bug or a well know behaviour?
>
> Stefano Fraccaro
>
> -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/users/
> *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
>
>
>


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