Re: New name

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Christoph Noack-2 Christoph Noack-2
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Re: New name

Hi Friedrich, hi Andy!

Am Dienstag, den 05.10.2010, 23:55 +0200 schrieb Friedrich Strohmaier:

> >Indeed :-) But then we have to ask Graham, whether he is so kind to
> > tell us where to find Martin's mail.
>
> I think Andy expects - like I do - that Oracle one of the big
> companies
> worldwide is able to give an official statement. This isn´t true yet.
>
> The info mentioned aparently was passed to computerworld:
> http://blogs.computerworld.com/17097/the_openoffice_fork_is_officially_here
>
> Seems, they have to stay hidden for some reason. ;o))

Personally, the statement we are currently referring to, is the only one
I am aware of. Moreover, I am also unaware of any official (like some of
us expect) statement for any of the other projects there are working on.
So at least I cannot tell you more, although I'd like to :-)

Cheers,
Christoph

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Friedrich Strohmaier Friedrich Strohmaier
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Godot's official statement (was:New name)

In reply to this post by Andy Brown
Hi Andy, *,

Andy Brown schrieb:

>On Tue Oct 05 2010 14:10:26 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Christoph Noack wrote:
>> Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 17:03 -0700 schrieb Andy Brown:
>>> On Mon Oct 04 2010 16:29:37 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Christoph Noack wrote:

[..]

>The article only states "Oracle said it was investing substantial
>resources in OpenOffice.org.

>“With more than 100 million users, we believe OpenOffice.org is the
> most advanced, most feature-rich open-source implementation and will
> strongly encourage the OpenOffice community to continue to contribute
> through www.openoffice.org,” the enterprise software and hardware
> giant said in a statement."  With no name or reference to where the
> statement can be see.

>>>> It has already been cited by Kürti on this list:
>>>> http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/msg00282.html

>>> A repeat of the "news article".

>> Aha. But what you mean? :-)

> Just what I said, the message only repeats the same "statement".
> Again no name or reference to where the full "statement" can be
> found.

>Who made the statement?  What is their position at Oracle?  Anyone can
>make a statement but how much weight does that statement carry?

> If you take it a face value then there is no way that Oracle is going
> to hand over the trademark or anything else to the community that has
> helped build it.  Do they actually think that "they" did all the work
> to get that 100 million users?  Yet there are some that hold to the
> idea.

No, they think they *bought* all the work. They have good reasons to
remain silent. We should accept that, stop thinking about it and go
ahead.

Gruß/regards
--
Friedrich

Ansprechpartner / contact person for the "PrOOo-Box"
german language OpenOffice.org and more on CD/DVD
http://prooo-box.org 


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Jean Weber Jean Weber
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Re: New name

In reply to this post by Andy Brown
On Tue, 2010-10-05 at 14:47 -0700, Andy Brown wrote:

> Just what I said, the message only repeats the same "statement".  Again
> no name or reference to where the full "statement" can be found.
>
> Who made the statement?  What is their position at Oracle?  Anyone can
> make a statement but how much weight does that statement carry?

When I had first read the news report, I thought -- or hoped -- that it
referred to a published or "official" statement somewhere.

Now that I have read the news report again, I realise that the
"statement" was most likely made in a phone call or email to the
reporter, and someone else on this thread referred to an email.
Anonymous comments of this type are quite common in journalism; many
government and company officials will not speak to journalists if they
are going to be quoted by name... especially if they have not gone
through the approval process at their company or department.

--Jean

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yorick yorick
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Re: New name

In reply to this post by Christoph Noack-2
Quoting Christoph Noack <[hidden email]>:

> Good evening Graham!
>
> Am Dienstag, den 05.10.2010, 19:24 +1300 schrieb Graham Lauder:
>> Thorsten, Charles and Christoph, please accept abject apologies.  I
>> shall now go hide in a hole somewheres.
>
> Oh, please do not :-) I owe you a lot of respect to state this here,
> really. Vice versa, please (everyone) please accept our apologies if
> things sometimes don't work like expected. Especially if it takes us so
> long to resolve such a (rather) small mis-understanding.
>
> So please let's continue to work together ... at the end, it is about
> the value of the idea :-)
>
> Bye,
> Christoph

Ack the hole, was boring and slightly damp in any case, let's do this
thing, the world is waiting.  :)

Cheers
GL

>
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>



--
Graham Lauder
************************************

The Best Things come in 3

http://why.openoffice.org
************************************
OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) New Zealand
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

INGOTs Assessor Trainer
http://www.theingots.org.nz

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italovignoli italovignoli
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Re: Godot's official statement

In reply to this post by Friedrich Strohmaier
Friedrich Strohmaier wrote:

>> If you take it a face value then there is no way that Oracle is going
>> to hand over the trademark or anything else to the community that has
>> helped build it.  Do they actually think that "they" did all the work
>> to get that 100 million users?  Yet there are some that hold to the
>> idea.
>
> No, they think they *bought* all the work. They have good reasons to
> remain silent. We should accept that, stop thinking about it and go
> ahead.

Please remind that Oracle is used to play in the corporate marketplace,
where the time has a different meaning. They want 15 days to approve a
quote in a press release, against two days requested by Microsoft (is
just an example).

In addition, they are used to "own" everything they buy. Look at what
has happened to PeopleSoft and Siebel, whose brands have disappeared
from the market.

If you spend a couple of hours reading online interviews to Larry
Ellison, you will be enlightened on the subject.

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Italo Vignoli
Mobile: +39.348.5653829 - VoIP: +39.02.320621813
Email: [hidden email] - Skype: italovignoli
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Italo Vignoli
Director - The Document Foundation
Paul A Norman Paul A Norman
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Re: New name

In reply to this post by Christoph Noack-2
For what it is worth -- my2c

  "LibreOffice"

Very well expresses the concept of what is being achieved,
from the development and adminsitratoin point of view.

From an end users perspective ...

Well, in International or other English, and possibly some other
Germanic/Nordic languages, it is a bit of a mouth full and actually
quite difficult to say.

Reason, for English any way, is that the "re" at the end of the first
word is pronounced "rah", but is then followed by pure vowel "Oh" and
then a closed "Vah" sound (top dental on  lower lip).

English speakers (International or otherwise) may shy away form that
as too much of a mouth-full (and actually be put off the product).

    LeeB Rah Ohh-fV iss

Also the reoccurance of a B - V sound not always popular in English

It doesn't inherently sound like anything that genral public people
can immeadiately identify with from other life experiences-- and also
may not for an end user actually imply any immeadiate useful concept.

Rhymes with Zebra (pronounced ammerican style ) - people will rhyme or
word assocaite if no inherent menaing springs forth in their monds ...
and so  ... by association ... AnimalOffice ZooOffice MonkeyOffice ?
Or something else ...
Hopefully not!!!

For Developers ...

    "With very few limitations on distribution or improvement;
including source code   en.wiktionary.org/wiki/libre "

Libre has a specific meaning for developers, but not necessarily the
general English speaking public.

Oxford does not deal with it in this context,

http://oxforddictionaries.com/search?searchType=dictionary&isWritersAndEd
itors=true&searchUri=All&q=libre&_searchBtn=Search&contentVersion
=WORLD

And neither does Google.

http://www.google.com/dictionary?langpair=en%7Cen&q=libre&hl=en&aqf

  libre
  Related phrases
  Cuba libre
  A cocktail typically containing cola, lime juice, rum, and a garnish of l
ime
  Related languages
  libre is also a word in: français,  Portuguese,  español

It may however well gell very well for people from academic and
Romance language backgrounds - Spanish, Portuguese, French, Italian
and so on..

In the same vein perhaps ...

  FreeOffice
 LibertyOffice (perhaps more for Americans :) )

Or

  FullOffice

Or something simillar actually capturing the essence of the actual product?

Paul

On 6 October 2010 11:05, Christoph Noack
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Friedrich, hi Andy!
>
> Am Dienstag, den 05.10.2010, 23:55 +0200 schrieb Friedrich Strohmaier:
>> >Indeed :-) But then we have to ask Graham, whether he is so kind to
>> > tell us where to find Martin's mail.
>>
>> I think Andy expects - like I do - that Oracle one of the big
>> companies
>> worldwide is able to give an official statement. This isn´t true yet.
>>
>> The info mentioned aparently was passed to computerworld:
>> http://blogs.computerworld.com/17097/the_openoffice_fork_is_officially_h
ere

>>
>> Seems, they have to stay hidden for some reason. ;o))
>
> Personally, the statement we are currently referring to, is the only one
> I am aware of. Moreover, I am also unaware of any official (like some of
> us expect) statement for any of the other projects there are working on.
> So at least I cannot tell you more, although I'd like to :-)
>
> Cheers,
> Christoph
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, send an empty e-mail to discuss+unsubscribe@documentfound
ation.org
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e deleted.
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scuss/
>
>
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yorick yorick
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Re: New name

In reply to this post by Christoph Noack-2
Quoting Christoph Noack <[hidden email]>:

> Hi Friedrich, hi Andy!
>
> Am Dienstag, den 05.10.2010, 23:55 +0200 schrieb Friedrich Strohmaier:
>> >Indeed :-) But then we have to ask Graham, whether he is so kind to
>> > tell us where to find Martin's mail.
>>
>> I think Andy expects - like I do - that Oracle one of the big
>> companies
>> worldwide is able to give an official statement. This isn´t true yet
.
>>
>> The info mentioned aparently was passed to computerworld:
>> http://blogs.computerworld.com/17097/the_openoffice_fork_is_officially_he
re

>>
>> Seems, they have to stay hidden for some reason. ;o))
>
> Personally, the statement we are currently referring to, is the only one
> I am aware of. Moreover, I am also unaware of any official (like some of
> us expect) statement for any of the other projects there are working on.
> So at least I cannot tell you more, although I'd like to :-)
>
> Cheers,
> Christoph
>

Until Oracle legal has gone over all the pros and cons of every
eventuality, figured out their exposure if any and crunched profit an
loss numbers, no-one from Oracle is going to take an official line.
which is as it should be, These things in a corporate space take time.

"Speak in haste, repent at leisure" is not a corporate tactic
everything has to be considered carefully to limit exposure.  There is
sufficient pressure on them to take an official line that, in time, we
will see a statement of their position.  However that will be done at
a time that suits their needs rather than ours.

Patience, all good things come in time and I'm glad they're giving it
due consideration, the longer they think about it the more likely a
positive response once they realise that in fact there is no real loss
to them.

cheer and in fact the gains could be substantial

cheers
GL

--
Graham Lauder
************************************

The Best Things come in 3

http://why.openoffice.org
************************************
OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) New Zealand
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

INGOTs Assessor Trainer
http://www.theingots.org.nz

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Andy Brown Andy Brown
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Re: Godot's official statement

In reply to this post by Friedrich Strohmaier
On Tue Oct 05 2010 15:16:39 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Friedrich Strohmaier wrote:

> Hi Andy, *,
>
> Andy Brown schrieb:
>> If you take it a face value then there is no way that Oracle is going
>> to hand over the trademark or anything else to the community that has
>> helped build it.  Do they actually think that "they" did all the work
>> to get that 100 million users?  Yet there are some that hold to the
>> idea.
>
> No, they think they *bought* all the work. They have good reasons to
> remain silent. We should accept that, stop thinking about it and go
> ahead.
>

I am sure that they have very good reasons, thus my questioning the
"statements" that have be credited to Oracle.  As I see it if the
community does not move on it will fail.

This in fighting over a name is not helping matters any.  The
"discussion" that is going on in some of the OOo list is not helping.

Andy
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epix epix
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Re: Godot's official statement

Hi,

Am 06.10.2010 01:26, schrieb Andy Brown:
> On Tue Oct 05 2010 15:16:39 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Friedrich Strohmaier wrote:
>> Andy Brown schrieb:
>>> If you take it a face value then there is no way that Oracle is going
>>> to hand over the trademark or anything else to the community that has
>>> helped build it.  Do they actually think that "they" did all the work
>>> to get that 100 million users?  Yet there are some that hold to the
>>> idea.

>> No, they think they *bought* all the work. They have good reasons to
>> remain silent. We should accept that, stop thinking about it and go
>> ahead.

> I am sure that they have very good reasons, thus my questioning the
> "statements" that have be credited to Oracle.  As I see it if the
> community does not move on it will fail.
> This in fighting over a name is not helping matters any.  The
> "discussion" that is going on in some of the OOo list is not helping.

*+1*

Erich
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Gianluca Turconi Gianluca Turconi
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Re: New name

In reply to this post by italovignoli
In data 05 ottobre 2010 alle ore 18:04:26, Italo Vignoli  
<[hidden email]> ha scritto:

> My friends are working hard at opening new mailing lists, and the
> localization is already active at [hidden email] (subscription
> works as for the other lists: [hidden email]).

Can such new lists be announced in the "announce" list too?

I'm subscribed to that list, but I haven't seen any news. Nor that list is  
listed on TDF main website.

Thanks,
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Gianluca Turconi Gianluca Turconi
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Re: New name

In data 06 ottobre 2010 alle ore 08:39:47, Gianluca Turconi  
<[hidden email]> ha scritto:

> I'm subscribed to that list, but I haven't seen any news. Nor that list  
> is listed on TDF main website.

Errata corrige: it's listed under "Contact" but not under "LibreOffice"  
section.
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André Schnabel André Schnabel
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Re: New name

In reply to this post by Gianluca Turconi
Hi,

> Von: "Gianluca Turconi" <[hidden email]>
> An: [hidden email]

>
> Can such new lists be announced in the "announce" list too?
>
> I'm subscribed to that list, but I haven't seen any news.

whatever happened .. I sent it to announce:

http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/announce/msg00004.html

André
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Gianluca Turconi Gianluca Turconi
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Re: New name

In data 06 ottobre 2010 alle ore 08:53:02, Andre Schnabel  
<[hidden email]> ha scritto:

> whatever happened .. I sent it to announce:
> http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/announce/msg00004.html

Well, here it didn't arrived. :)

However, I saw the users@ announce.
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