Regroup and further development of the website(s)

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Wheatbix Wheatbix
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Regroup and further development of the website(s)

Another CMS/website conversation on the discuss list has highlighted
to me that we need to regroup after the new year and start putting in
our best for the website team.

Over the past two weeks a lot of work has been put in by
David/Florian/Christian and others to get the Silverstripe site up and
running.
We need to start looking at what needs improvement.

David et al, could we get an update on what has been done so far and
what needs to be done in your mind.

It has also become clear that the conversations about the Drupal
development are becoming a slight distraction for the wider community,
so might I suggest that we nominate a period after the LibO3.3 release
to discuss the future plans for the website. I will organise a Conf
Call when this comes about.

Getting back to the point,
I feel that the wider website team has more to offer, but we need some
guidance when it comes to the Silverstripe system and areas which need
work. Could we coordinate this work through a task list in the wiki in
the same way we have done with the Drupal development. It seems to
work quite well :)

Thanks,
Michael Wheatland

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davidnelson davidnelson
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

Hi, :-)

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 18:03, Michael Wheatland
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> David et al, could we get an update on what has been done so far and
> what needs to be done in your mind.

My take on things that the best thing would be to wait until January
10. On that date, the SilverStripe site will have been re-themed, and
I'll have finished what I set out to achieve with the content.

I'll be "handing back" to the SC, and will be humbly suggesting that
they might take some decisions about how to manage the site. But I've
no idea what their intentions are in that respect.

After that, I guess there will be some kind of community/team
consultation process, but I'm not aware of what form that will take.
If it's decided that I'll be asked to make changes/alterations, I will
certainly make them. But if it's decided that SC members want to take
control of things, then I'll be happy to comply with that as well.

In any case, my original goal will have been fulfilled: the
LibreOffice project finally has an operational website that will look
credible.

Ivan is currently working on the theme right now, after we've
consulted together, and I think the result is going to look pretty
good. However, like the content, the theme will be up for review and
approval, and if changes are decided then they'll be made.

So, the best thing is to hang on for another week or so, and then
listen out for news from the SC.

David Nelson

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Wheatbix Wheatbix
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 7:51 PM, David Nelson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, :-)
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 18:03, Michael Wheatland
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> David et al, could we get an update on what has been done so far and
>> what needs to be done in your mind.
>
> My take on things that the best thing would be to wait until January
> 10. On that date, the SilverStripe site will have been re-themed, and
> I'll have finished what I set out to achieve with the content.
>
> I'll be "handing back" to the SC, and will be humbly suggesting that
> they might take some decisions about how to manage the site. But I've
> no idea what their intentions are in that respect.
>
> After that, I guess there will be some kind of community/team
> consultation process, but I'm not aware of what form that will take.
> If it's decided that I'll be asked to make changes/alterations, I will
> certainly make them. But if it's decided that SC members want to take
> control of things, then I'll be happy to comply with that as well.

I think a 'handback' to the wider website team would be more appropriate.
The SC made the decision to go with Silverstripe because a consensus
could not be made within this team.
It will be our responsibility to improve and maintain the site and
infrastructure moving forward.

> In any case, my original goal will have been fulfilled: the
> LibreOffice project finally has an operational website that will look
> credible.
>
> Ivan is currently working on the theme right now, after we've
> consulted together, and I think the result is going to look pretty
> good. However, like the content, the theme will be up for review and
> approval, and if changes are decided then they'll be made.
>
> So, the best thing is to hang on for another week or so, and then
> listen out for news from the SC.

Again,
Thanks for all of your hard work, and when you are ready to involve
more people we are poised to start contributing to the site.

Michael Wheatland

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davidnelson davidnelson
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

Hi, :-)

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 18:45, Michael Wheatland
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> I think a 'handback' to the wider website team would be more appropriate.
> The SC made the decision to go with Silverstripe because a consensus
> could not be made within this team.
> It will be our responsibility to improve and maintain the site and
> infrastructure moving forward.

I have put a lot of time and energy into what I've done, and I've
decided to specifically hand it back to the SC, on the 10th. I'll be
mailing them beforehand, and they will obviously be free to take what
action they like. ;-)

So, Michael, I think the wisest thing is that neither you nor I should
make any assumptions about anything. It will be the SC that decides.
;-)

David Nelson

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Wheatbix Wheatbix
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 8:25 PM, David Nelson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, :-)
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 18:45, Michael Wheatland
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I think a 'handback' to the wider website team would be more appropriate.
>> The SC made the decision to go with Silverstripe because a consensus
>> could not be made within this team.
>> It will be our responsibility to improve and maintain the site and
>> infrastructure moving forward.
>
> I have put a lot of time and energy into what I've done, and I've
> decided to specifically hand it back to the SC, on the 10th. I'll be
> mailing them beforehand, and they will obviously be free to take what
> action they like. ;-)
>
> So, Michael, I think the wisest thing is that neither you nor I should
> make any assumptions about anything. It will be the SC that decides.
> ;-)
>
> David Nelson

I am somewhat confused. Are you suggesting that someone other than the
website team will be maintaining and improving the website?

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Charles-H. Schulz Charles-H. Schulz
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

Michael,

2011/1/4 Michael Wheatland <[hidden email]>

> On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 8:25 PM, David Nelson <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > Hi, :-)
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 18:45, Michael Wheatland
> > <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> I think a 'handback' to the wider website team would be more
> appropriate.
> >> The SC made the decision to go with Silverstripe because a consensus
> >> could not be made within this team.
> >> It will be our responsibility to improve and maintain the site and
> >> infrastructure moving forward.
> >
> > I have put a lot of time and energy into what I've done, and I've
> > decided to specifically hand it back to the SC, on the 10th. I'll be
> > mailing them beforehand, and they will obviously be free to take what
> > action they like. ;-)
> >
> > So, Michael, I think the wisest thing is that neither you nor I should
> > make any assumptions about anything. It will be the SC that decides.
> > ;-)
> >
> > David Nelson
>
> I am somewhat confused. Are you suggesting that someone other than the
> website team will be maintaining and improving the website?
>

I can't answer for David, obviously, but I can say that the website and the
infrastructure is run by admins who may or may not be part of the website
team.
But the website team obviously ought to interact with them.

Cheers,

Charles.


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Wheatbix Wheatbix
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

> I can't answer for David, obviously, but I can say that the website and the
> infrastructure is run by admins who may or may not be part of the website
> team.
> But the website team obviously ought to interact with them.

I don't want to be a conspiracy theorist, but this sounds like you are
suggesting that the website team has no autonomy, responsibility or
accountability.

It would be good to clarify this situation sooner rather than later,
as progress hinges on decisions.
As a group we need to know that any informed decisions we make can and
will be implemented without relying on outside parties to implement it
for us.

Would this autonomy hinge on us raising the funds to support our own
website infrastructure rather than relying on ODF servers?

Thanks,
Michael Wheatland

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Christoph Noack Christoph Noack
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

Hi Michael,

to throw in another guess ...

Am Dienstag, den 04.01.2011, 21:33 +0930 schrieb Michael Wheatland:

> > I can't answer for David, obviously, but I can say that the website
> and the
> > infrastructure is run by admins who may or may not be part of the
> website
> > team.
> > But the website team obviously ought to interact with them.
>
> I don't want to be a conspiracy theorist, but this sounds like you are
> suggesting that the website team has no autonomy, responsibility or
> accountability.

I think there might be some slight misunderstanding between Charles and
you.

As far as I understand, you talked about the content and the structure
of the website. I simply assume that website means (to you) all the
infrastructure elements that are visible to the user, even the planet,
the wiki, ... Of course, this will be managed by the community (and by
the way: the local communities already do this for the localized pages
of the Silverstripe site, e.g. [1]).

If I got Charles right, then he refers to the technical aspects of
server maintenance that run the website services. As far as I know, only
few administrators will have access to that servers, because otherwise
we need to expose the passwords/certificates. But that should be fine
for managing DNS and stuff like that.

And now my personal take: At the moment, having a young project like
LibO, I do see the need to organize / confirm decisions that have some
substantial impact. For example, the initial branding (visual design)
has been accepted (SC decision, discussion with the community) to focus
on the first releases. There will be changes, of course, but it just
makes life easier to have something rather conservative to start with,
and then continue to work on it on a broader basis - after having had a
deep breath.

As far as I understand, this is very similar to the website work ...
having Silverstripe as a first technical basis which might get replaced
if the requirements by the community are not met (any longer). Thus,
concerning your initial idea of revisiting / discussing the current
status with the whole website team / interested people: +1

Cheers,
Christoph

[1] http://de.libreoffice.org/


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Christian Lohmaier (klammer) Christian Lohmaier (klammer)
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Re: Regroup and further development of the website(s)

In reply to this post by Wheatbix
Hi Michael, *,

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 1:03 PM, Michael Wheatland
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I can't answer for David, obviously, but I can say that the website and the
>> infrastructure is run by admins who may or may not be part of the website
>> team.
>> But the website team obviously ought to interact with them.
>
> I don't want to be a conspiracy theorist, but this sounds like you are
> suggesting that the website team has no autonomy, responsibility or
> accountability.

To make it short: There is a difference between the people running a
site technically and those who are providing and maintaining the
site's content. As simple as that.

And while David did create the first iteration as "one-man-show" - he
basically provided the content himself, this of course will not be the
way to go on forever. One person just cannot do it all himself, so it
is then "handed over" again, after the period of time where David (and
a few other volunteers) did put a concentrated effort into providing
the initial site and theme. So David will "hand it back", back from
being filled with content by him, worked on by a small set of people,
back to how it will be community managed.

And how that managing will be performed (who is responsible for what
areas, who can edit, who can publish, who can <whatever>) is of course
to be discussed on this list.

Please when someone already writes some weired "term in quotes" -
don't take it literally.

ciao
Christian

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Narayan Aras Narayan Aras
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Taxonomically arranged metamodel on web, to evolve strategic directions for the LibO community

In reply to this post by Christoph Noack

Hi all,

While brainstorming about the Drupal website, I went through the past discussion at the mail list.

I was struck by the fact that several ideas (similar/contrasting) are repeated several times by different people.
The ideas are scattered in multiple posts under unrelated headings.

For example, one post is extremely remarkable: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/website/msg01908.html
Although it starts with the title "Extensions List suggestion", it goes on to expound the design philosophy for the website.

This just goes to show how precious thoughts are getting lost in that black hole of a mail list.

What we need is a website section that captures such ideas and collates them.
In other words, a meta-model for the community.
With such modeling, we can consciously change the very nature of our community, website and product.

It should also be designed so that all ideas converge on a collective decision, and don't remain soap-box speeches.

Imagine a website section, which has-
1. A navigational bar at left, which contains taxonomically arranged tree of all relevant topics
2. Each node of the tree has a wiki page to capture the thoughts.
3. Each page can be linked to a concept map (or an argument map) to settle conflicts.
4. Each page has "See also" section, so that interdependencies (if any) can be highlighted.

This would be a "live" section, forever changing to respond to new ideas, new needs and new challenges.
Especially, the tree (similar to the folder tree we see in Windows Explorer) would keep evolving.

How about it?

Regards,
-Narayan
     
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Narayan Aras Narayan Aras
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RE: Taxonomically arranged metamodel on web, to evolve strategic directions for the LibO community


Oops! Forgot to describe how to make it work:

1. Every quarter, the SC conducts a review of the entire model, and decides what actions to be taken.
    Since the concept maps/argument maps would already explore all pros and cons, the conclusion becomes self-evident.

2. In case of sensitive issues, SC can conduct a poll to verify the public mood.


Regards,
Narayan

     
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marcpare4 marcpare4
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Re: Taxonomically arranged metamodel on web, to evolve strategic directions for the LibO community

Le 2011-01-13 05:13, Narayan Aras a écrit :

>
> Oops! Forgot to describe how to make it work:
>
> 1. Every quarter, the SC conducts a review of the entire model, and decides what actions to be taken.
>      Since the concept maps/argument maps would already explore all pros and cons, the conclusion becomes self-evident.
>
> 2. In case of sensitive issues, SC can conduct a poll to verify the public mood.
>
>
> Regards,
> Narayan
>
>    

Thanks for those 2 posts Narayan.

At the moment, the place to put these ideas is on the "Marketing->ideas"
wiki page [1]. For now it is a matter for people to discuss as best as
possible their idea on this list and then for someone to post the result
on the "idea" page. The ideas are reviewed often by the marketing team
and may/or not be worked on. Good examples are the: "LibreOffice Desktop
Reference Cards" which are being worked on, the "LibreOffice paper
airplane" still in progress, etc. These particular two ideas are being
worked on for upcoming conferences where they could be shown to
LibreOffice booth visitors.

Yes, I also agree there should be a process that properly collect these
ideas.

Cheers

Marc

[1] http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Ideas


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