Trial of LibreOffice

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Alwyn Alwyn
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Trial of LibreOffice

I am still trialling LO but have one or two issues.  

1.  With Open Office I always updated using the British version so that dates, spelling etc automatically adopt the British format.
It is proving tedious to have to convert all my spreadsheet date formats so I wonder if there is a similar facility in LO?

2.  If I want to edit an existing Word document I find that the format painter will not in all circumstances reformat all paragraphs to match.  For example I have tried to set paragraph spacing identically for several paragraphs but it seems only to do it for paras that matched beforehand.   The always worked in Open Office but not in LO.

So far the only advantage seems to be that LO can create to docx and xlsx formats.  Unless these problems can be resolved I fear that I will have to revert to OO.
Alex Thurgood Alex Thurgood
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

Le 29/09/2016 à 14:31, Alwyn a écrit :

Hi Alwyn,

> I am still trialling LO but have one or two issues.  
>
> 1.  With Open Office I always updated using the British version so that
> dates, spelling etc automatically adopt the British format.
> It is proving tedious to have to convert all my spreadsheet date formats so
> I wonder if there is a similar facility in LO?

Have you installed the en-GB language pack and changed the defaults
under Tools > Options > Languages  > Date acceptance patterns ?


Alex



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Alwyn Alwyn
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

Thanks.  

I have downloaded both the latest version of Libre Office and the language pack.  I think that the set up for Macs must be different as those options aren't in Tools.  A search in Help showed them in LibreOffice/Preferences/Languages etc.  I seem now to have succeeded in changing language and date settings for all documents.

The formatting issue remains to be resolved.
Alex Thurgood Alex Thurgood
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

Le 30/09/2016 à 13:19, Alwyn a écrit :

> The formatting issue remains to be resolved.
>

What can I say, the format painter uses hard formatting, and that is
frowned upon by those who use styles ;-)

It may of course be a bug in the format painter, searching in the
LibreOffice bugzilla might enable you to find out if others have had the
same problem.


Alex



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TomD TomD
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

Hi :)
There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
alongside each other.  Mostly i tend to find they are so much the same that
either will do, although i have a slight preference for LibreOffice.

I found these guides to be the best help with LibreOffice;
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Documentation/Publications

Chapter 3 of the "Getting Started Guide" helps a lot with styles and
formatting but a long-term user of OpenOffice might not find anything
hugely new or different.

I tend to find most documents written with MS Office a pita tbh.  I tend to
just copy&paste as "unformatted text" into a new document and then apply my
own formatting.  Back when i used to use MS Office too it would take hours,
even days, to reformat even a 1-2 page document to fit into the
newsletter.  Using "paste as plain text" (or as unformatted text) helped
quite a lot but LibreOffice/OpenOffice's "Styles" made such work take just
a few minutes.  I'm not sure what i'd do if the document was many pages
long or highly complex though.

Regards from
Tom :)



On 30 September 2016 at 13:16, Alexander Thurgood <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Le 30/09/2016 à 13:19, Alwyn a écrit :
>
> > The formatting issue remains to be resolved.
> >
>
> What can I say, the format painter uses hard formatting, and that is
> frowned upon by those who use styles ;-)
>
> It may of course be a bug in the format painter, searching in the
> LibreOffice bugzilla might enable you to find out if others have had the
> same problem.
>
>
> Alex
>
>
>
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>

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V Stuart Foote V Stuart Foote
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

TomD wrote
There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
alongside each other.  
...
Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature from in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type" dialog of checks to not assign a program association.

Stuart
Alwyn Alwyn
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by TomD
Thanks Tom,

That's most helpful and I note that it also includes the tabs for Mac Users.  It occurs to me that it is probably possible to set up a particular style for a paragraph; this might be possible with a macro for example.  I will explore these instructions.  My wife is still using Open Office but, as my iMac is nearly 6 years old I am trying not to overload it with stuff.

By the way there seems to be a typo after the word MS Office.  I suspect you meant to say a 'pain in the ....'

steveedmonds steveedmonds
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by V Stuart Foote


On 2016-10-01 04:21, V Stuart Foote wrote:

> TomD wrote
>> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
>> alongside each other.
>> ...
> Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
> perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature from
> in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
> dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
>
> Stuart
>
I have had then running side by side on Linux fine for a few years, no
special install. I still have to keep OO to cater for functionality
dropped from LO and it works fine.
Steve

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Girvin Herr-4 Girvin Herr-4
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

On 09/30/2016 02:23 PM, Steve Edmonds wrote:

>
>
> On 2016-10-01 04:21, V Stuart Foote wrote:
>> TomD wrote
>>> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
>>> alongside each other.
>>> ...
>> Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
>> perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature
>> from
>> in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
>> dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
>>
>> Stuart
>>
> I have had then running side by side on Linux fine for a few years, no
> special install. I still have to keep OO to cater for functionality
> dropped from LO and it works fine.
> Steve
>
+1.

AOO 4.1.2 + LO 5.0.6.3 + Slackware Linux 14.1 (k3.10.103). However, I do
not use the "Quick Starter" - my choice.  ...And vice-versa: LO still
has the Base Report Generator, AOO does not. So I keep them both for the
features I like and rely upon.

Girvin Herr



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Jay Lozier Jay Lozier
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice



On 09/30/2016 06:19 PM, Girvin Herr wrote:

> On 09/30/2016 02:23 PM, Steve Edmonds wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 2016-10-01 04:21, V Stuart Foote wrote:
>>> TomD wrote
>>>> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
>>>> alongside each other.
>>>> ...
>>> Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
>>> perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter"
>>> feature from
>>> in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
>>> dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
>>>
>>> Stuart
>>>
>> I have had then running side by side on Linux fine for a few years,
>> no special install. I still have to keep OO to cater for
>> functionality dropped from LO and it works fine.
>> Steve
>>
> +1.
>
> AOO 4.1.2 + LO 5.0.6.3 + Slackware Linux 14.1 (k3.10.103). However, I
> do not use the "Quick Starter" - my choice.  ...And vice-versa: LO
> still has the Base Report Generator, AOO does not. So I keep them both
> for the features I like and rely upon.
>
> Girvin Herr
>
>
>
+1 AOO and LO "fresh" on Arch Linux, with the LO quick starter. No problems.

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TomD TomD
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

Hi :)
Ahh, there used to be problems but i thought those had all been sorted
out.  The trick was to make sure that LO and AOO weren't actively running
at the same time - hence the need to disable the QuickStarter.

If there are still problems with a straight-forwards install alongside
OpenOffice then these instructions might help a re-try;
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Installing_in_parallel/OS_X

Apols if i made a tpyo and for guessing my probable intent so well :)

Also thanks to all who pointed out a possible error error in my advice and
for giving a good correction.  Also thanks to all the people who reassured
me that i had good reason for saying what i did. :))  Both are good
reasons, imo, for preferring forums/email-lists to traditional forms of
support that rely on a single point-of-contact.
Many thanks, good luck and regards from
Tom :)


On 1 October 2016 at 00:23, Jay Lozier <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> On 09/30/2016 06:19 PM, Girvin Herr wrote:
>
>> On 09/30/2016 02:23 PM, Steve Edmonds wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2016-10-01 04:21, V Stuart Foote wrote:
>>>
>>>> TomD wrote
>>>>
>>>>> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
>>>>> alongside each other.
>>>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>> Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
>>>> perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature
>>>> from
>>>> in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
>>>> dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
>>>>
>>>> Stuart
>>>>
>>>> I have had then running side by side on Linux fine for a few years, no
>>> special install. I still have to keep OO to cater for functionality dropped
>>> from LO and it works fine.
>>> Steve
>>>
>>> +1.
>>
>> AOO 4.1.2 + LO 5.0.6.3 + Slackware Linux 14.1 (k3.10.103). However, I do
>> not use the "Quick Starter" - my choice.  ...And vice-versa: LO still has
>> the Base Report Generator, AOO does not. So I keep them both for the
>> features I like and rely upon.
>>
>> Girvin Herr
>>
>>
>>
>> +1 AOO and LO "fresh" on Arch Linux, with the LO quick starter. No
> problems.
>
>
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James Knott James Knott
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by V Stuart Foote
On 09/30/2016 11:21 AM, V Stuart Foote wrote:

> TomD wrote
>> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
>> alongside each other.  
>> ...
> Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
> perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature from
> in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
> dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
>
>

I have both installed on both Linux and Windows.  No issues I've noticed.


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TomD TomD
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

Hi :)
Thanks :)  I think it used to be quite noticeable.  Whichever one was open
first (including quick-starter if that was enabled) would stay fine but the
2nd instance wouldn't open, or would get part-way open and then crash.

I think the problem was caused by LibreOffice and OpenOffice (and i think
the various forks which have now mostly merged back into LO or AOO afaik)
using the same command to open;
soffice
Since this would attempt to re-open the same program/suite in the same
program-folder but also trying to be whichever one you'd tried to open 2nd
it would all get very confusing for the poor machine.  It's possibly
entirely different from that but that is the way i understood it at the
time from various people trying to explain it.

So if you've not noticed that sort of thing happening then you are probably
fine.
Regards from
Tom :)

On 1 October 2016 at 12:18, James Knott <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 09/30/2016 11:21 AM, V Stuart Foote wrote:
> > TomD wrote
> >> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
> >> alongside each other.
> >> ...
> > Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
> > perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature
> from
> > in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
> > dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
> >
> >
>
> I have both installed on both Linux and Windows.  No issues I've noticed.
>
>
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>
>

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jonathon-6 jonathon-6
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

On 04/10/2016 15:35, Tom Davies wrote:

> I think the problem was caused by LibreOffice and OpenOffice (and i think
> the various forks which have now mostly merged back into LO or AOO afaik)
> using the same command to open;
> soffice

That is a problem when one doesn't use the full path, when starting the
program from the command line.

In an ideal world, AOo, EO, LibO, NO,and the other variants would use a
different command.  This is something that would have to be done by the
project.

jonathon

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Girvin Herr-4 Girvin Herr-4
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by TomD
Tom et al.,
I looked at this a while back and discovered that on my Slackware
system, LO and AOO are installed into separate sub-directories in /opt,
with symlinks in /usr/bin with different names pointing to the
appropriate soffice.  soffice seems to be some sort of legacy name from
the old Star Office days.  I, too, wonder why it is not changed to be
something more unique.  However, I am not privy to the inner workings of
these programs nor organizations.  The symlinks are an adequate work-around.
Girvin Herr


On 10/04/2016 08:35 AM, Tom Davies wrote:

> Hi :)
> Thanks :)  I think it used to be quite noticeable.  Whichever one was open
> first (including quick-starter if that was enabled) would stay fine but the
> 2nd instance wouldn't open, or would get part-way open and then crash.
>
> I think the problem was caused by LibreOffice and OpenOffice (and i think
> the various forks which have now mostly merged back into LO or AOO afaik)
> using the same command to open;
> soffice
> Since this would attempt to re-open the same program/suite in the same
> program-folder but also trying to be whichever one you'd tried to open 2nd
> it would all get very confusing for the poor machine.  It's possibly
> entirely different from that but that is the way i understood it at the
> time from various people trying to explain it.
>
> So if you've not noticed that sort of thing happening then you are probably
> fine.
> Regards from
> Tom :)
>
> On 1 October 2016 at 12:18, James Knott <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On 09/30/2016 11:21 AM, V Stuart Foote wrote:
>>> TomD wrote
>>>> There is no harm in having both LibreOffice and OpenOffice installed
>>>> alongside each other.
>>>> ...
>>> Actually they do not get along all that well, but will coexist if you
>>> perform a custom installation and disable the "Quick Starter" feature
>> from
>>> in the Optional Components section both--and also clear the "File Type"
>>> dialog of checks to not assign a program association.
>>>
>>>
>> I have both installed on both Linux and Windows.  No issues I've noticed.
>>
>>
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>> deleted
>>
>>


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James Knott James Knott
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by TomD
On 10/04/2016 11:35 AM, Tom Davies wrote:

> Thanks :)  I think it used to be quite noticeable.  Whichever one was open
> first (including quick-starter if that was enabled) would stay fine but the
> 2nd instance wouldn't open, or would get part-way open and then crash.
>
> I think the problem was caused by LibreOffice and OpenOffice (and i think
> the various forks which have now mostly merged back into LO or AOO afaik)
> using the same command to open;
> soffice
> Since this would attempt to re-open the same program/suite in the same
> program-folder but also trying to be whichever one you'd tried to open 2nd
> it would all get very confusing for the poor machine.  It's possibly
> entirely different from that but that is the way i understood it at the
> time from various people trying to explain it.

Neither of them currently uses soffice.  LibreOffice uses libreoffice
and OpenOffice uses openoffice4.


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V Stuart Foote V Stuart Foote
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

This post was updated on .
James Knott wrote
Neither of them currently uses soffice.  LibreOffice uses libreoffice
and OpenOffice uses openoffice4.
Sorry, Tom Davies is correct.

Those actually are names of the AppData folders holding the user profile, both programs on Windows builds use a mixed--soffice.exe launcher and soffice.bin runtime.  

And yes they conflict when both are fully installed/configured in Windows registry--HKCU and HKLM/Software and especially if an instance of one or the other is running an soffice.bin process of its QuickStarter.

James Knott James Knott
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

On 10/04/2016 10:06 PM, V Stuart Foote wrote:

> James Knott wrote
>> Neither of them currently uses soffice.  LibreOffice uses libreoffice
>> and OpenOffice uses openoffice4.
> Sorry, Dave is correct.
>
> Those actually are names of the AppData folders holding the user profile,
> both programs on Windows builds use a mixed--soffice.exe launcher and
> soffice.bin runtime.  
>
> And yes they conflict when both are fully installed/configured in Windows
> registry--HKCU and HKLM/Software and especially if an instance of one or the
> other is running an soffice.bin process of its QuickStarter.
>
>

Well, the KDE menu uses those commands, rather than soffice and they
also work at the command line.  If I use soffice, I get LibreOffice.
/usr/bin/libreoffice is a symlink to /lib64/libreoffice/program/soffice,
but /usr/bin/openoffice4 is a binary.




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Doug McNutt Doug McNutt
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by Alex Thurgood
I'm not sure this thread is about my problems but the title sure fits. I
have  had some real problems with what used to be an Excel 2001
spreadsheet running on a Mac 8500 with which I am now having hardware
problems. I am also using Linux these days and I find it a real release
from the likes of touch screens and gestures. My first machine was a
Control Data 1604 that I programmed in assembly language using a
Hollerith card punch. Fortran, was new without any year following the name.

My first spreadsheet ran on a Heathkit H49 which drove a TV receiver and
it has grown a bit into Excel 2001 but I did a lot of things that
modified the spreadsheet so that it works my way. Apple's Macintosh
Programmer's Workshop served as my way to write tools that are now
called Macros.

I open my Excel spreadsheet in a Linux shell using the command
"librecalc Finance_16.xls".

OpenCalc reads it fine and warns me "Macros may contain viruses.
Execution of macros is disabled due to the current macro security
setting in Tools - Options - LibreOffice - Security."

I don't yet understand that because I haver used anything but the
spreadsheet in MS Office but I really expect that I would have some
programming to do to make them work with OpenCalc. I accepted the
offering to create a new file that I named Finance_16.ods and the
spreadsheet now comes up the way I expect.  But it still warns me about
Macros! I expected them to disappear. There seems to be no way to
attempt execution of any of them. I miss my "sort and find now".

My spreadsheet uses one line to represent a payment or a deposit. The
first three columns are dates that are the initiation of the
transaction, the clearance date at the bank, and a forecast date which
is not, at least yet, a problem. The next column I call "method" and is
sometimes "DISC" for a well known credit card but also may be a check
number or a flag my macros might use to indicate work yet to be done on
the details. The E column indicates which of the bank accounts is
involved and might be just "s" for cash operations. Out in J,K,L,M
adjustments to balances on the appropriate accounts are made using the
value in column F. The code there is carefully done so that rows can be
added easily without any need to adjust the parameters. Example,
=OFFSET(K614,-1,0)-Amount*BalOp. That "K614" item is taken to mean the
row in which the formula resides. and OpenCalc might, and might not, do
that the way Excel does. The BalOp is a flag that depends on other
columns in the ledger. -1 is a deposit, 0 means no change, and +1 is a
payment. Lines that are paid but not closed are treated depending on a
Macro setting that identifies what we want to see "today".

One thing I like to do is to log in to my bank and download their idea
of changes for a month or less. They like to allow download of data that
shows amounts and dates when transactions cleared. The bank likes comma
separated ASCII text but in Excel2001 I have to have tab separations. A
bit of perl5 fixes that easily but neither seems to work for OpenCalc. I
like to use a separate sheet in a workbook to accept the bank data and
make appropriate adjustments so that the data fits into the columns
above. A copy and paste special makes it easy, in a macro, to get the
bank's idea and allows me to insert those lines into the ledger sheet at
a point close, in time, to the previously entered checks.  I can sort
them by the amount of the transaction and quickly change the clear time
and, perish the thought, add in whole transactions made by the lady of
the house. After the fix I change column A, the date, to blank and an
overall sort will take them to the bottom for deletion.

   BUT   OpenCalc seems to have other ideas.

1: The dates from Discover or the bank have date values as MM/DD/YYYY.
When I place them over in the right and allow spreadsheet formulas to
move them to the right place they come out `MM/DD/YYYY with the starting
apostrophe that tells Calc to leave them alone and never convert to date
even when I carefully format the receiving cells to MM/DD which is what
I really want. There may be a way but I haven't figured it out yet. The
problem is the same for directly reading a CSV file

2: When I add the bank items into a point in the ledger near the current
time there seems to be no way to ask for a sort that works only for
selected rows. In fact I can make OpenCalc forget about the names I have
carefully given to the 4 rows at the top and the rest of the ledger.

3: I need a way to insert the bank lines into the defined range and
expect the definition of the range to recognize the number of lines
involved. Adding 15, or maybe a miscounted 17, lines to a range is
needed and I really don't like that. Perhaps there is a way with macros.
. . I did find a couple of suggestions for adding a single row in the
middle of a range. But why not a simple ability to paste above a
selected line? Excel does it.

4: OpenCalc needs to have a way to accept dates, when explicitly told,
from the MM/DD/YYYY stuff that banks use. It also needs to be very clear
about the underlying float for days and fractions thereof. I think I'm
using 1904 as the zero of time but it's not clear that is always true or
if it just remembers what Apple set in Excel. I have not found anywhere
in the published information that says 1904 and I'm really on a Linux
box that uses 1970.

5: /I do have more but I do hope I can be helpful.

Doug
/

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Girvin Herr-4 Girvin Herr-4
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Re: Trial of LibreOffice

In reply to this post by James Knott
On 10/04/2016 07:20 PM, James Knott wrote:

> On 10/04/2016 10:06 PM, V Stuart Foote wrote:
>> James Knott wrote
>>> Neither of them currently uses soffice.  LibreOffice uses libreoffice
>>> and OpenOffice uses openoffice4.
>> Sorry, Dave is correct.
>>
>> Those actually are names of the AppData folders holding the user profile,
>> both programs on Windows builds use a mixed--soffice.exe launcher and
>> soffice.bin runtime.
>>
>> And yes they conflict when both are fully installed/configured in Windows
>> registry--HKCU and HKLM/Software and especially if an instance of one or the
>> other is running an soffice.bin process of its QuickStarter.
>>
>>
> Well, the KDE menu uses those commands, rather than soffice and they
> also work at the command line.  If I use soffice, I get LibreOffice.
> /usr/bin/libreoffice is a symlink to /lib64/libreoffice/program/soffice,
> but /usr/bin/openoffice4 is a binary.
>
James,

Maybe not.  Have you looked at your /usr/bin/openoffice4 ?

On my Slackware system, I have a /usr/bin/openoffice4 file and it is a
shell script which invokes /opt/openoffice4/program/soffice with "$0" as
an argument.

Shell scripts are marked executable, but they are not a binary. You can
read them as plain text.

Girvin Herr




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