[libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

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Mihovil Stanic Mihovil Stanic
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[libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

If 4.3 translation fully transfered or?
Only 10 strings seams unreal. :)

It's probably not finished yet, but just want to mention that it would
be nice to also transfer all dismissed errors like it was with 4.1 -> 4.2.
On 4.2 I have 100% translated strings and 0 errors. On 4.3 there are
around 2500 errors present.
Same with 4.1 which has around 1500 errors. It was 0 before move to 4.2,
but since it's finished release and I'm sure everything was ok before
transfer, I don't mind.

Best regards,
Mihovil

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Christian Lohmaier-3 Christian Lohmaier-3
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

Hi Mihovil, *,

Am 02.05.2014 10:34 schrieb "Mihovil Stanic" <[hidden email]>:
>
> If 4.3 translation fully transfered or?
> Only 10 strings seams unreal. :)

nope. Availability hasn't been announced yet. Esp. When you're looking at
help, the machine is busy crunching numbers, updating against templates.

The only libo-ui language that has been updated against templates was AF.
First in list, so had to be the labrat :-)

> It's probably not finished yet, but just want to mention that it would be
nice to also transfer all dismissed errors like it was with 4.1 -> 4.2.

Not sure what you mean with that. What's currently happening is that the
changed helpids/tags get auto-changed.

> On 4.2 I have 100% translated strings and 0 errors. On 4.3 there are
around 2500 errors present.

Ah, now I understand. Unfortunately that's not stored in the po files, so
would need digging deep in the database. So that's something for later.

Ciao
Christian

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Andras Timar Andras Timar
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 11:49 AM, Christian Lohmaier
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On 4.2 I have 100% translated strings and 0 errors. On 4.3 there are
> around 2500 errors present.
>
> Ah, now I understand. Unfortunately that's not stored in the po files, so
> would need digging deep in the database. So that's something for later.

This is why we had libo_ui and libo_help projects without a version
number, most of the work is done there. You can just create libo42_ui
and libo42_help projects and move 4.2 files there, and update 4.3 in
the unversioned project. This way the error status metadata is kept.

Regards,
Andras

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Christian Lohmaier-3 Christian Lohmaier-3
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

Hi Andras, *,

On Friday, May 2, 2014, Andras Timar <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 11:49 AM, Christian Lohmaier
> <[hidden email] <javascript:;>> wrote:
> >
> >> On 4.2 I have 100% translated strings and 0 errors. On 4.3 there are
> > around 2500 errors present.
> >
> > Ah, now I understand. Unfortunately that's not stored in the po files, so
> > would need digging deep in the database. So that's something for later.
>
> This is why we had libo_ui and libo_help projects without a version
> number, most of the work is done there. You can just create libo42_ui
> and libo42_help projects and move 4.2 files there, and update 4.3 in
> the unversioned project. This way the error status metadata is kept.
>

That way you loose the error-markings for the 4.2 branch. so everything has
drawbacks.

Import is already running for many ours, so I don't really want to abort
that just because of that.

Rather such a high number of errors indicate a poblem with the check
itself, doesn't it?

ciao
Christain

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Mihovil Stanic Mihovil Stanic
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

If I have to choose, keep old system where all dismissed errors are
transfered to new branch.
Why?

4.2 branch l10n became active in november 2013. That is almost 6 months
to date.
Whoever wanted to translate it 100% and clear all errors, already did
that. It's less damage to have same error re-appear in finished 4.2 with
which most translators will have minimum contact with, then in 4.3 where
you need to mark them all as NON error all over again.

Please don't force us to do meaningless work.

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/hr/libo41x_ui/
Here you can see what are those errors. 4.1 was 100% error free before
4.2 branch.

900 unchanged - we don't translate name, brands, and few english words
like "Status" are spelled same in EN and HR
222 simple capitalization - Mostly Because Of Those New Found English
Spelling Where You Capitalize Every First Letter In Sentence
136 acronyms - I think every ALL CAPITAL LETTER WORD is marked as
acronym, like "OK" for example which we translate "U redu" and that's an
error
101 punctuation spacing - this is trivial, if in EN you have "something
(something)." and in HR it is "(something) something." it's an error
and so on...

Best regards,
Mihovil



Dana 2.5.2014 12:13, Christian Lohmaier je napisao:

> Hi Andras, *,
>
> On Friday, May 2, 2014, Andras Timar <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 11:49 AM, Christian Lohmaier
>     <[hidden email] <javascript:;>> wrote:
>     >
>     >> On 4.2 I have 100% translated strings and 0 errors. On 4.3
>     there are
>     > around 2500 errors present.
>     >
>     > Ah, now I understand. Unfortunately that's not stored in the po
>     files, so
>     > would need digging deep in the database. So that's something for
>     later.
>
>     This is why we had libo_ui and libo_help projects without a version
>     number, most of the work is done there. You can just create libo42_ui
>     and libo42_help projects and move 4.2 files there, and update 4.3 in
>     the unversioned project. This way the error status metadata is kept.
>
>
> That way you loose the error-markings for the 4.2 branch. so
> everything has drawbacks.
>
> Import is already running for many ours, so I don't really want to
> abort that just because of that.
>
> Rather such a high number of errors indicate a poblem with the check
> itself, doesn't it?
>
> ciao
> Christain


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Adolfo Jayme Barrientos-3 Adolfo Jayme Barrientos-3
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 7:03 AM, Mihovil Stanic <[hidden email]> wrote:

> If I have to choose, keep old system where all dismissed errors are
> transfered to new branch.
> Why?
>
> 4.2 branch l10n became active in november 2013. That is almost 6 months to
> date.
> Whoever wanted to translate it 100% and clear all errors, already did that.
> It's less damage to have same error re-appear in finished 4.2 with which
> most translators will have minimum contact with, then in 4.3 where you need
> to mark them all as NON error all over again.
>
> Please don't force us to do meaningless work.
>
> https://translations.documentfoundation.org/hr/libo41x_ui/
> Here you can see what are those errors. 4.1 was 100% error free before 4.2
> branch.


To be honest, as a translator and Pootle user, I’ve never seen the
benefit of removing all the error checks. Why? It’s super simple:
Pootle is software and as such it can’t know whether its checks are
correct and valid.

Checks are automated, and do not affect the actual functioning of the
PO files (well, except some “critical” ones), and in most cases are
wrong. For example, for Spanish I’ve been replacing all the English
quotation marks with French ones (« and »). Every time I do this for a
string, a Pootle error check is triggered and added to it, warning me
that the quotation marks do not match the English string. Of course,
my change is intentional and the check is useless, so I ignore it.

You should only work in “critical” tags and others that are
meaniingful for your language, and the checks sent by Cloph, that
actually AFFECT LibreOffice’s functioning. Don’t try to achieve an
“error-clean” Pootle folder; it simply is not worth the effort. And
the fact that Pootle doesn’t preserve its string checks’ state means
(to me) that checks are just AN AID, a guideline for translators, and
that’s it.

Regards

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Mihovil Stanic Mihovil Stanic
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

You are right. But since I'm already on 100% error free that allows me to
catch errors I make. Every release I catch about 10-20 new errors I
unintentionally make trough those.
Dana 3. 5. 2014. 05:48 osoba "Adolfo Jayme Barrientos" <[hidden email]>
napisala je:

> On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 7:03 AM, Mihovil Stanic <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > If I have to choose, keep old system where all dismissed errors are
> > transfered to new branch.
> > Why?
> >
> > 4.2 branch l10n became active in november 2013. That is almost 6 months
> to
> > date.
> > Whoever wanted to translate it 100% and clear all errors, already did
> that.
> > It's less damage to have same error re-appear in finished 4.2 with which
> > most translators will have minimum contact with, then in 4.3 where you
> need
> > to mark them all as NON error all over again.
> >
> > Please don't force us to do meaningless work.
> >
> > https://translations.documentfoundation.org/hr/libo41x_ui/
> > Here you can see what are those errors. 4.1 was 100% error free before
> 4.2
> > branch.
>
>
> To be honest, as a translator and Pootle user, I’ve never seen the
> benefit of removing all the error checks. Why? It’s super simple:
> Pootle is software and as such it can’t know whether its checks are
> correct and valid.
>
> Checks are automated, and do not affect the actual functioning of the
> PO files (well, except some “critical” ones), and in most cases are
> wrong. For example, for Spanish I’ve been replacing all the English
> quotation marks with French ones (« and »). Every time I do this for a
> string, a Pootle error check is triggered and added to it, warning me
> that the quotation marks do not match the English string. Of course,
> my change is intentional and the check is useless, so I ignore it.
>
> You should only work in “critical” tags and others that are
> meaniingful for your language, and the checks sent by Cloph, that
> actually AFFECT LibreOffice’s functioning. Don’t try to achieve an
> “error-clean” Pootle folder; it simply is not worth the effort. And
> the fact that Pootle doesn’t preserve its string checks’ state means
> (to me) that checks are just AN AID, a guideline for translators, and
> that’s it.
>
> Regards
>

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Joan Montané Joan Montané
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

2014-05-03 9:17 GMT+02:00 Stanić Mihovil <[hidden email]>:

> You are right. But since I'm already on 100% error free that allows me to
> catch errors I make. Every release I catch about 10-20 new errors I
> unintentionally make trough those.
>


I full agree with Mihovil Stanic.

 libo_ui and libo_help projects without a version number allow to keep l10n
quality checks. But all works is lost with this new approach. We can't do
the same work every 6 months! It's a meaningless.

Joan Montané

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Mihovil Stanic Mihovil Stanic
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] 4.3 translation

In reply to this post by Christian Lohmaier-3
Is this final decision?
With this you also loose all contribution numbers and who made changes
on which strings in project (and when).
Total contributions will probably stay as total in language folder,
until you decide to remove 4.2 folder in 6 months time with introduction
of 4.4 line.

It is an option to have just one folder/project and not allow changes on
"stable" project after 6 months?

2013/11 - 4.2 BETA1 - no more l10n changes on 4.1 branch, 4.2 is only
active branch (2 months in beta, 4 months in stable)
2014/05 - 4.3 BETA 1 - no more l10n changes on 4.2 branch, 4.3 is only
active branch (2 months in beta, 4 months in stable)
2014/11 - 4.4 BETA 1 - no more l10n changes on 4.3 branch, 4.4 is only
active branch (2 months in beta, 4 months in stable)
etc...

Best regards,
Mihovil

Dana 2.5.2014 12:13, Christian Lohmaier je napisao:

> Hi Andras, *,
>
> On Friday, May 2, 2014, Andras Timar <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 11:49 AM, Christian Lohmaier
>     <[hidden email] <javascript:;>> wrote:
>     >
>     >> On 4.2 I have 100% translated strings and 0 errors. On 4.3
>     there are
>     > around 2500 errors present.
>     >
>     > Ah, now I understand. Unfortunately that's not stored in the po
>     files, so
>     > would need digging deep in the database. So that's something for
>     later.
>
>     This is why we had libo_ui and libo_help projects without a version
>     number, most of the work is done there. You can just create libo42_ui
>     and libo42_help projects and move 4.2 files there, and update 4.3 in
>     the unversioned project. This way the error status metadata is kept.
>
>
> That way you loose the error-markings for the 4.2 branch. so
> everything has drawbacks.
>
> Import is already running for many ours, so I don't really want to
> abort that just because of that.
>
> Rather such a high number of errors indicate a poblem with the check
> itself, doesn't it?
>
> ciao
> Christain


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