[libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

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Niklas Johansson Niklas Johansson
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[libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hi

During the community meetings of the LibreOffice conference there was a
discussion of accelerator keys in menus and how duplicate use of the same
accelerator key causes accessibility issues. It can be hard when
translating to know if a string is duplicated in a menu or not so I noted
that there are some accessibility checkers that check the menus of programs
for such issues. And promised to send a note here stating what checkers
does.

After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux, Windows
and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the tool
in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).

For the time being you can download the macros from:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8e703zr5bxny27n/AcceleratorKeyChecker.odt?dl=1

There are some issues such as the tool can't reach submenus that has been
deactivated. But for now this will probably do for most of you.

Regards,
/Niklas

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Michael Bauer Michael Bauer
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hi Niklas,

This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened.
The main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique
UI string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit
type hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is
E&dit, it won't get found.

The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when
you start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have
the resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are
the usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings
are sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets
(Gaelic has 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)

Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
"Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a
tool that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to
strip them all from the existing files so the system can automatically
deal with the issue.

Michael

Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux, Windows
> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the tool
> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).

--
*Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
Facs: +44-141-945 2701

*Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
<http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>

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Niklas Johansson Niklas Johansson
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hi Michael

Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should be
set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which will
list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.

Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.

/Niklas

2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:

> Hi Niklas,
>
> This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened. The
> main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique UI
> string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
> incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit type
> hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is E&dit, it
> won't get found.
>
> The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
> hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when you
> start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have the
> resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are the
> usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings are
> sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets (Gaelic has
> 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
>
> Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
> "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a tool
> that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to strip
> them all from the existing files so the system can automatically deal with
> the issue.
>
> Michael
>
> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
>
> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
>> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
>> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
>> Windows
>> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the tool
>> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
>>
>
> --
> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>
> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>
> --
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> Problems?
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Baurzhan Muftakhidinov Baurzhan Muftakhidinov
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Well done, Niklas!
Although It looks like for Cyrillic locales accelerators are not being put
to result correctly, all I see is little rectangles instead of actual
accellerator letters.
Latin letters are being processed correctly.

Thanks,

On Thu, Sep 24, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Niklas Johansson
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Michael
>
> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should be
> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which will
> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>
> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>
> /Niklas
>
> 2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>
>> Hi Niklas,
>>
>> This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened. The
>> main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique UI
>> string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
>> incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit type
>> hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is E&dit, it
>> won't get found.
>>
>> The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
>> hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when you
>> start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have the
>> resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are the
>> usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings are
>> sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets (Gaelic has
>> 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
>>
>> Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
>> "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a tool
>> that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to strip
>> them all from the existing files so the system can automatically deal with
>> the issue.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
>>
>> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
>>> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
>>> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
>>> Windows
>>> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the tool
>>> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
>>>
>>
>> --
>> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
>> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
>> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
>> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>>
>> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
>> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
>> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
>> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>>
>> --
>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
>> Problems?
>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>> deleted
>>
>
> --
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Michael Bauer Michael Bauer
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Niklas Johansson
I was not aware that it had been implemented, that's good news :)

If you could point me at a page that explains how to KeyID, that would
be great.

Michael

Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 12:39:

> Hi Michael
>
> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should be
> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which will
> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>
> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>
> /Niklas

--
*Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
Facs: +44-141-945 2701

*Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
<http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>

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Niklas Johansson Niklas Johansson
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hello again

A short description of how to use KeyID can be found at:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language#KeyID

The dialy builds of LibreOffice should contain the KeyID version (has the
language code qtz)
http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/

/Niklas

2015-09-24 14:25 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:

> I was not aware that it had been implemented, that's good news :)
>
> If you could point me at a page that explains how to KeyID, that would be
> great.
>
> Michael
>
> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 12:39:
>
>> Hi Michael
>>
>> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
>> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should
>> be
>> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which
>> will
>> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
>> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
>> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>>
>> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>>
>> /Niklas
>>
>
> --
> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>
> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>
> --
> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
> Problems?
> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
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> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> deleted
>

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Michael Bauer Michael Bauer
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Thank you!

Michael

Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 13:42:
> A short description of how to use KeyID can be found at:
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language#KeyID
>
> The dialy builds of LibreOffice should contain the KeyID version (has the
> language code qtz)
> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/
>
> /Niklas

--
*Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
Facs: +44-141-945 2701

*Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
<http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>

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Rhoslyn Prys-2 Rhoslyn Prys-2
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Niklas Johansson
This is great! Plenty of work to do...

I'm having difficulty getting the KeyID to work, I've identified that
the necessary files may be:
master~2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_en-US_de_ar_ja_ru_qtz.msi
<http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Win-x86@62-merge-TDF/2015-09-23_05.16.23/master%7E2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_en-US_de_ar_ja_ru_qtz.msi>

and possibly
master~2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_helppack_qtz.msi
<http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Win-x86@62-merge-TDF/2015-09-23_05.16.23/master%7E2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_helppack_qtz.msi>  
and have installed both and followed the instructions: Tools>Options>Language Settings>Languages>User Interface.

But I'm only seeing English USA. I'm not seeing KeyID, nor de, ar, ja or ru. I'm doing something wrong here.
Any suggestions?
Rhos



Ar 24/09/2015 13:42, ysgrifennodd Niklas Johansson:

> Hello again
>
> A short description of how to use KeyID can be found at:
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language#KeyID
>
> The dialy builds of LibreOffice should contain the KeyID version (has the
> language code qtz)
> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/
>
> /Niklas
>
> 2015-09-24 14:25 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>
>> I was not aware that it had been implemented, that's good news :)
>>
>> If you could point me at a page that explains how to KeyID, that would be
>> great.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 12:39:
>>
>>> Hi Michael
>>>
>>> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
>>> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should
>>> be
>>> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which
>>> will
>>> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
>>> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
>>> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>>>
>>> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>>>
>>> /Niklas
>>>
>> --
>> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
>> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
>> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
>> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>>
>> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
>> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
>> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
>> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>>
>> --
>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
>> Problems?
>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>> deleted
>>


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Sérgio Marques Sérgio Marques
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Niklas Johansson
Hi Niklas

Will this tool work on fresh builds without keyid?

Regards

2015-09-24 12:39 GMT+01:00 Niklas Johansson <[hidden email]>:

> Hi Michael
>
> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should be
> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which will
> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>
> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>
> /Niklas
>
> 2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>
> > Hi Niklas,
> >
> > This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened. The
> > main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique UI
> > string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
> > incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit
> type
> > hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is E&dit, it
> > won't get found.
> >
> > The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
> > hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when
> you
> > start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have the
> > resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are the
> > usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings are
> > sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets (Gaelic has
> > 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
> >
> > Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
> > "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a
> tool
> > that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to strip
> > them all from the existing files so the system can automatically deal
> with
> > the issue.
> >
> > Michael
> >
> > Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
> >
> > After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
> >> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
> >> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
> >> Windows
> >> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the
> tool
> >> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
> >>
> >
> > --
> > *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
> > Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
> > Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
> > Facs: +44-141-945 2701
> >
> > *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
> > Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
> > geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net>
> > <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
> >
> > --
> > To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
> > Problems?
> > http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
> > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
> > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
> > All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> > deleted
> >
>
> --
> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
> Problems?
> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
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Serg Bormant Serg Bormant
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Rhoslyn Prys-2
2015-09-24 19:53 GMT+03:00 Rhoslyn Prys <[hidden email]>:
>
> But I'm only seeing English USA. I'm not seeing KeyID, nor de, ar, ja or ru.
> I'm doing something wrong here.
> Any suggestions?

Click Tools - Options - Language Settings - Languages,
then select KeyID in User interface dropbox and restart LO.

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Rhoslyn Prys-2 Rhoslyn Prys-2
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Thanks, Serg.

What I've done - twice on two separate computers, is to install both :
master~2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_en-US_de_ar_ja_ru_qtz.msi
<http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Win-x86@62-merge-TDF/2015-09-23_05.16.23/master%7E2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_en-US_de_ar_ja_ru_qtz.msi>

and
master~2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_helppack_qtz.msi
<http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/master/Win-x86@62-merge-TDF/2015-09-23_05.16.23/master%7E2015-09-23_05.16.23_LibreOfficeDev_5.1.0.0.alpha1_Win_x86_helppack_qtz.msi>  

Then I've gone to: Tools>Options>Language Settings>Languages>User Interface.

But all I'm seeing in the dropdown menue is English USA. No KeyID, de, ar, ja or ru or anything else.


The detail on https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language does not relate to what's on the server,
I could'nt find files with langpack_qtz in their name, am I using the wrong files? If so where are the right files?


      KeyID

For major versions, KeyID builds are available in alpha and beta
releases. This special build allows to display the KeyID reference of
each string in the menus and dialogs. It is a available as a language
pack, where the language reference is replaced by *qtz* in the version
name (for example
LibreOfficeDev_4.3.0.0.alpha1_Linux_x86-64_deb_langpack_qtz.tar.gz and
LibreOfficeDev_4.2.0.0.beta2_Linux_x86_deb_langpack_qtz.tar.gz).

To install this lang pack:

  * download the package
  * depending on your system, install it as usual after installing the
    main package
  * go under Tools ▸ Options ▸ Language Settings ▸ Languages and change
    the *User Interface* to *KeyID*
  * when you reopen LibreOffice, you can see now the string reference in
    front of each menu and dialog

Thanks
Rhos

Ar 25/09/2015 08:23, ysgrifennodd Serg Bormant:

> 2015-09-24 19:53 GMT+03:00 Rhoslyn Prys <[hidden email]>:
>> But I'm only seeing English USA. I'm not seeing KeyID, nor de, ar, ja or ru.
>> I'm doing something wrong here.
>> Any suggestions?
> Click Tools - Options - Language Settings - Languages,
> then select KeyID in User interface dropbox and restart LO.
>
> --
> wbr, sb
>


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Mihovil Stanić Mihovil Stanić
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Niklas Johansson
I'm searching for this, but can't find.
Using Linux Mint, would like to get that language pack to get key IDs.

Your script is working perfectly!

24.09.2015 u 14:42, Niklas Johansson je napisao/la:
> The dialy builds of LibreOffice should contain the KeyID version (has the
> language code qtz)
> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/
>
> /Niklas
>
>


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Niklas Johansson Niklas Johansson
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hmm... I should have checked that before posting. I usually just run my
own build version on Linux,
I just assumed that they would have qtz-builds at least for master, but
it seems they don't. :(

You can however find qtz-builds of 5.0.0.0.beta3:
https://downloadarchive.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/old/5.0.0.0.beta3/deb/

The KeyIDs should correspond to what is in LibreOffice 5.

I'll ask on IRC tomorrow if there are any KeyID-builds available for
Linux as daily builds,
or if not if there could be in the future.

Don't forget do do a parallel install:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Installing_in_parallel/Linux

Regards,
Niklas Johansson

Den 2015-10-03 kl. 19:47, skrev Mihovil Stanić:

> I'm searching for this, but can't find.
> Using Linux Mint, would like to get that language pack to get key IDs.
>
> Your script is working perfectly!
>
> 24.09.2015 u 14:42, Niklas Johansson je napisao/la:
>> The dialy builds of LibreOffice should contain the KeyID version (has
>> the
>> language code qtz)
>> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/
>>
>> /Niklas
>>
>>
>
>


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Mihovil Stanić
I created a accelerator key report for KeyID from a master build (a few
days old though).
That way you can easily compare the reports to find the menu entries in
Pootle.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/a9pwjonlhnefja8/KeyID%20-%20Accelerator%20key%20check%20report.odt?dl=1

Regards,
Niklas Johansson

Den 2015-10-03 kl. 19:47, skrev Mihovil Stanić:

> I'm searching for this, but can't find.
> Using Linux Mint, would like to get that language pack to get key IDs.
>
> Your script is working perfectly!
>
> 24.09.2015 u 14:42, Niklas Johansson je napisao/la:
>> The dialy builds of LibreOffice should contain the KeyID version (has
>> the
>> language code qtz)
>> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/
>>
>> /Niklas
>>
>>
>
>


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

In reply to this post by Baurzhan Muftakhidinov
Last Friday my first patch towards this issue got pushed, so now the
tool should
work on the master branch, even for non ascii characters.

I did a test with the tool on the language Kazakh, you'll find the
report below.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/d1yguco1u2w0s6c/Kazakh%20-%20Accelerator%20key%20check%20report.odt?dl=1

Regards,
Niklas Johansson

Den 2015-09-24 kl. 14:12, skrev Baurzhan Muftakhidinov:

> Well done, Niklas!
> Although It looks like for Cyrillic locales accelerators are not being put
> to result correctly, all I see is little rectangles instead of actual
> accellerator letters.
> Latin letters are being processed correctly.
>
> Thanks,
>
> On Thu, Sep 24, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Niklas Johansson
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi Michael
>>
>> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
>> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should be
>> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which will
>> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
>> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
>> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>>
>> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>>
>> /Niklas
>>
>> 2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>>
>>> Hi Niklas,
>>>
>>> This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened. The
>>> main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique UI
>>> string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
>>> incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit type
>>> hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is E&dit, it
>>> won't get found.
>>>
>>> The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
>>> hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when you
>>> start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have the
>>> resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are the
>>> usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings are
>>> sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets (Gaelic has
>>> 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
>>>
>>> Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
>>> "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a tool
>>> that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to strip
>>> them all from the existing files so the system can automatically deal with
>>> the issue.
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
>>>
>>> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
>>>> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
>>>> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
>>>> Windows
>>>> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the tool
>>>> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
>>>>
>>> --
>>> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
>>> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
>>> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
>>> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>>>
>>> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
>>> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
>>> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
>>> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>>>
>>> --
>>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
>>> Problems?
>>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
>>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>>> deleted
>>>
>> --
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Baurzhan Muftakhidinov Baurzhan Muftakhidinov
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hi,
Do you have updated macros, or is it still the same? When do you think
your patch will enter regular release, wIll it make to 5.0.x?

Thanks,

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Niklas Johansson
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Last Friday my first patch towards this issue got pushed, so now the tool
> should
> work on the master branch, even for non ascii characters.
>
> I did a test with the tool on the language Kazakh, you'll find the report
> below.
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/d1yguco1u2w0s6c/Kazakh%20-%20Accelerator%20key%20check%20report.odt?dl=1
>
> Regards,
> Niklas Johansson
>
>
> Den 2015-09-24 kl. 14:12, skrev Baurzhan Muftakhidinov:
>>
>> Well done, Niklas!
>> Although It looks like for Cyrillic locales accelerators are not being put
>> to result correctly, all I see is little rectangles instead of actual
>> accellerator letters.
>> Latin letters are being processed correctly.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 24, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Niklas Johansson
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Michael
>>>
>>> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
>>> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should
>>> be
>>> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which
>>> will
>>> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
>>> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
>>> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>>>
>>> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>>>
>>> /Niklas
>>>
>>> 2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>>>
>>>> Hi Niklas,
>>>>
>>>> This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened.
>>>> The
>>>> main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique UI
>>>> string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
>>>> incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit
>>>> type
>>>> hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is E&dit,
>>>> it
>>>> won't get found.
>>>>
>>>> The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
>>>> hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when
>>>> you
>>>> start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have the
>>>> resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are the
>>>> usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings are
>>>> sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets (Gaelic
>>>> has
>>>> 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
>>>>
>>>> Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
>>>> "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a
>>>> tool
>>>> that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to
>>>> strip
>>>> them all from the existing files so the system can automatically deal
>>>> with
>>>> the issue.
>>>>
>>>> Michael
>>>>
>>>> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
>>>>
>>>> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
>>>>>
>>>>> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
>>>>> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
>>>>> Windows
>>>>> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the
>>>>> tool
>>>>> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
>>>> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
>>>> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
>>>> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>>>>
>>>> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
>>>> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
>>>> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
>>>> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
>>>> Problems?
>>>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>>>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>>>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
>>>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>>>> deleted
>>>>
>>> --
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>>> deleted
>
>
>
> --
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Niklas Johansson Niklas Johansson
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Hi

No the macro document from before should work, the change is in LibreOffice.
I haven't back ported the patch to 5.0 yet waiting a bit to see if my
follow-up
patch gets pushed first. Plus I'm a bit short on time at the moment. ;)
But I will likely ask for a back port in the following week or so.

Regards,
Niklas Johansson

Den 2015-10-07 kl. 09:16, skrev Baurzhan Muftakhidinov:

> Hi,
> Do you have updated macros, or is it still the same? When do you think
> your patch will enter regular release, wIll it make to 5.0.x?
>
> Thanks,
>
> On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Niklas Johansson
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Last Friday my first patch towards this issue got pushed, so now the tool
>> should
>> work on the master branch, even for non ascii characters.
>>
>> I did a test with the tool on the language Kazakh, you'll find the report
>> below.
>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/d1yguco1u2w0s6c/Kazakh%20-%20Accelerator%20key%20check%20report.odt?dl=1
>>
>> Regards,
>> Niklas Johansson
>>
>>
>> Den 2015-09-24 kl. 14:12, skrev Baurzhan Muftakhidinov:
>>> Well done, Niklas!
>>> Although It looks like for Cyrillic locales accelerators are not being put
>>> to result correctly, all I see is little rectangles instead of actual
>>> accellerator letters.
>>> Latin letters are being processed correctly.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 24, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Niklas Johansson
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> Hi Michael
>>>>
>>>> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you open the
>>>> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice should
>>>> be
>>>> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report, which
>>>> will
>>>> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu entries.
>>>> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the report
>>>> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>>>>
>>>> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>>>>
>>>> /Niklas
>>>>
>>>> 2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Niklas,
>>>>>
>>>>> This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever happened.
>>>>> The
>>>>> main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the unique UI
>>>>> string, it's not much help because most of the time there are like 50
>>>>> incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and &Edit
>>>>> type
>>>>> hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is E&dit,
>>>>> it
>>>>> won't get found.
>>>>>
>>>>> The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not assign
>>>>> hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells you when
>>>>> you
>>>>> start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have the
>>>>> resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there are the
>>>>> usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI strings are
>>>>> sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets (Gaelic
>>>>> has
>>>>> 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
>>>>>
>>>>> Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
>>>>> "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope. And/or a
>>>>> tool
>>>>> that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to
>>>>> strip
>>>>> them all from the existing files so the system can automatically deal
>>>>> with
>>>>> the issue.
>>>>>
>>>>> Michael
>>>>>
>>>>> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
>>>>>
>>>>> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small tool in
>>>>>> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the menus and
>>>>>> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
>>>>>> Windows
>>>>>> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use the
>>>>>> tool
>>>>>> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
>>>>> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
>>>>> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
>>>>> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>>>>>
>>>>> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
>>>>> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
>>>>> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
>>>>> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: [hidden email]
>>>>> Problems?
>>>>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>>>>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>>>>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/
>>>>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>>>>> deleted
>>>>>
>>>> --
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>>>> deleted
>>
>>
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Rhoslyn Prys-2 Rhoslyn Prys-2
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Basic tool to detect duplicate use of accelerator keys in menus

Has anyone got this to work? It could be handy.
I checked the latest build:
libreoffice-5-0~2015-11-11_12.42.14_LibreOfficeDev_5.0.4.0.0_Win_x86_en-US_de_ar_ja_ru_qtz.msi

and then Tools>Options>User Interface but no qtz.
Any suggestions?
Rhos

Ar 07/10/2015 08:57, ysgrifennodd Niklas Johansson:

> Hi
>
> No the macro document from before should work, the change is in
> LibreOffice.
> I haven't back ported the patch to 5.0 yet waiting a bit to see if my
> follow-up
> patch gets pushed first. Plus I'm a bit short on time at the moment. ;)
> But I will likely ask for a back port in the following week or so.
>
> Regards,
> Niklas Johansson
>
> Den 2015-10-07 kl. 09:16, skrev Baurzhan Muftakhidinov:
>> Hi,
>> Do you have updated macros, or is it still the same? When do you think
>> your patch will enter regular release, wIll it make to 5.0.x?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Niklas Johansson
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Last Friday my first patch towards this issue got pushed, so now the
>>> tool
>>> should
>>> work on the master branch, even for non ascii characters.
>>>
>>> I did a test with the tool on the language Kazakh, you'll find the
>>> report
>>> below.
>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/d1yguco1u2w0s6c/Kazakh%20-%20Accelerator%20key%20check%20report.odt?dl=1 
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Niklas Johansson
>>>
>>>
>>> Den 2015-09-24 kl. 14:12, skrev Baurzhan Muftakhidinov:
>>>> Well done, Niklas!
>>>> Although It looks like for Cyrillic locales accelerators are not
>>>> being put
>>>> to result correctly, all I see is little rectangles instead of actual
>>>> accellerator letters.
>>>> Latin letters are being processed correctly.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Sep 24, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Niklas Johansson
>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>> Hi Michael
>>>>>
>>>>> Well this is not as big a problem as you make it. Basically you
>>>>> open the
>>>>> document I sent a link to earlier. The UI language of LibreOffice
>>>>> should
>>>>> be
>>>>> set to the language that you want to check. Generate the report,
>>>>> which
>>>>> will
>>>>> list all menus and sub-menus and highlight the problematic menu
>>>>> entries.
>>>>> Save the file and change the UI language to KeyID and reopen the
>>>>> report
>>>>> there. Now you can easily find the exact string in Pootle.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you do not know what KeyID is and how to use it.
>>>>>
>>>>> /Niklas
>>>>>
>>>>> 2015-09-24 11:29 GMT+02:00 Michael Bauer <[hidden email]>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Niklas,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This has often been debated but I don't think anything ever
>>>>>> happened.
>>>>>> The
>>>>>> main issue with any such tool is that unless it links to the
>>>>>> unique UI
>>>>>> string, it's not much help because most of the time there are
>>>>>> like 50
>>>>>> incidences of &Edit and to make matters worse, we have _Edit and
>>>>>> &Edit
>>>>>> type
>>>>>> hotkeys and worse still, if I search for Edit and the string is
>>>>>> E&dit,
>>>>>> it
>>>>>> won't get found.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The summary of previous discussions is that if a locale does not
>>>>>> assign
>>>>>> hotkeys, the system does it automatically - which no one tells
>>>>>> you when
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> start out, and while I'd prefer that for our locale, I don't have
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> resources to strip all existing hotkeys. Other than that, there
>>>>>> are the
>>>>>> usual problems of not knowing the scope (i.e. what other UI
>>>>>> strings are
>>>>>> sharing the menu with said string) and restricted letter sets
>>>>>> (Gaelic
>>>>>> has
>>>>>> 18 letters, fewer if you ignore letters with descenders...)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ideally I think we'd need a tool which during localization flags
>>>>>> "Duplicated hotkey in menu scope" + list of strings in scope.
>>>>>> And/or a
>>>>>> tool
>>>>>> that allows locales which do not want to assign hotkeys manually to
>>>>>> strip
>>>>>> them all from the existing files so the system can automatically
>>>>>> deal
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> the issue.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Michael
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sgrìobh Niklas Johansson na leanas 24/09/2015 aig 10:01:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> After thinking a bit about it I instead decided to write a small
>>>>>> tool in
>>>>>>> basic that uses the accessibility interfaces to traverse the
>>>>>>> menus and
>>>>>>> print a report in Writer. This makes it possible to run from Linux,
>>>>>>> Windows
>>>>>>> and even on Mac. You'll find some more information on how to use
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> tool
>>>>>>> in the document below (also containing the relevant macros).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> *Akerbeltz <http://www.faclair.com/>*
>>>>>> Goireasan Gàidhlig air an lìon
>>>>>> Fòn: +44-141-946 4437
>>>>>> Facs: +44-141-945 2701
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Tha Gàidhlig aig a' choimpiutair agad, siuthad, feuch e!*
>>>>>> Iomadh rud eadar prògraman oifis, brabhsairean, predictive texting,
>>>>>> geamannan is mòran a bharrachd. Tadhail oirnn aig www.iGàidhlig.net
>>>>>> <http://www.xn--igidhlig-0ya.net> <http://www.iGaidhlig.net/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>
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