[steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

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André Schnabel André Schnabel
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[steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Dear SC (and probaly BoD ;) ) members,

as we have discussed previously, the paragraphs about the membership
committee in the current statutes draft differ in some points from what
we have in the bylaws. I hope, I can provide a translation of the
relevant paragraphs early next week. But I want to have some discussion
on the matter already in the first BoD meeting.

Reason for that is, that the MC should be elected by the TDF members
(and not appointed by the BoD). But the BoD would be responsible to
prepare and monitor the MC elections. The MC will be an official body of
the Foundation and therefore it's members will be named on inauguration
of the Foundation. For this first MC, we to not need to tion exactly
follow the elecion rules, as it's members will be named by the founder.
But I think, we all agree, that it would be best to start with an
elected MC (rather to just appojnt some people).

Ok, main differences (for compostion and duties) in the statutes
(compared to current bylaws) are:

- MC will be elected by the TDF members (formally named Board of
Trustees) using STV method (so we can use the same method as for BoD
elections)

- Number of MC members will be a minimum of three and a maximum of 10%
of the number of TDF members and needs to be an odd number (means we are
quite flexible here but BoD needs to decide about the certain number)

- MC represents the Foundation judicial and extrajudicial against the
members of the board (in case of conflict) and processes appeals from
the members to the BoD (means it is responsible for processing solemn
address and impeachment process that are mentioned in our bylaws)

- MC will elect a chairperson among it's members. This chairperson has
no special powers but the duty to confirm the minutes taken from MC
decisions



There is some more legal text in the statutes but these are the main
points (other MC members might correct me).


To go on with the elections, my suggestion for the would be to the same
election system as we used for the BoD elections. As it was very
helpfull to have Simon as Election Secretary, BoD should also name one
for the MC elections (looking for volunteers here).

BoD needs also to vote on the number of MC members. Current MC suggests
to have 5 members (plus 2 deputies if we have enough candidates).

A suggested timeline then might be:

-20    04.11.11   Announce elections
                   prepare infrastructure
                   document election process details ...
-15    09.11.11   freeze membership process (or take snapshot that
                   defines eligible members)
-14    10.11.11   start nomination,
                   Introduction / discussion with nominees ...
-3     21.11.11   publish final list of nominees
                   Introduction / discussion with nominees ...
0      24.11.11   Start of elections
                   elections running
7      01.12.11   elections closed
                   counting votes,
9      03.12.11   publish result
                   time to appeal
12     06.12.11   publish final result


We had some discussion, if we should freeze again the membership
process. BoD should decide on that (I personally would not like to have
again some weeks where we do not accept new members, at the other hand
it might be easy to challenge the vote, if we don't freeze.)

In any case the MC should have a spezial meeting to process applications
one or two days before the date when the process is frozen (or snapshot
is taken).

This scedule is still very late, if we want to do the inauguration with
an elected MC. Anyway .. I don't see, how we could speed up this process
and still keep it fair for all of our members.


best regards,

André

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Norbert Thiebaud Norbert Thiebaud
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

2011/10/26 André Schnabel <[hidden email]>:
>
> We had some discussion, if we should freeze again the membership process.
> BoD should decide on that (I personally would not like to have again some
> weeks where we do not accept new members, at the other hand it might be easy
> to challenge the vote, if we don't freeze.)

'Freezing' the membership does not necessarily means stop processing
applications, but just that the list of eligible member for the
election is 'frozen' at that date.
The list of member can still grow, but people that get membershp after
the freeze date are not eligible to vote in that election.

Norbert

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André Schnabel André Schnabel
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hi,

-------- Original-Nachricht --------
> Datum: Wed, 26 Oct 2011 17:29:34 -0500
> Von: Norbert Thiebaud <[hidden email]>

> 2011/10/26 André Schnabel <[hidden email]>:
> >
> > We had some discussion, if we should freeze again the membership
> process.
> > BoD should decide on that (I personally would not like to have again
> some
> > weeks where we do not accept new members, at the other hand it might be
> easy
> > to challenge the vote, if we don't freeze.)
>
> 'Freezing' the membership does not necessarily means stop processing
> applications, but just that the list of eligible member for the
> election is 'frozen' at that date.

That's what I meant with "take a snapshot".

For the BoD elections we agreed to not process membership applications
from start of nomination period until end of elections. Means, MC will
start to accept new members next monday again.

regards,

André

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Thorsten Behrens Thorsten Behrens
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by Norbert Thiebaud
Norbert Thiebaud wrote:
> 'Freezing' the membership does not necessarily means stop processing
> applications, but just that the list of eligible member for the
> election is 'frozen' at that date.
> The list of member can still grow, but people that get membershp after
> the freeze date are not eligible to vote in that election.
>
I'd still suggest to suspend MC work during that time - sure, people
can still apply for membership, and sure, MC members can send out
receival confirmations. But since it's the very MC that is then
standing for election, I think it is standard practice that this
body cease to make decisions during that time.

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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Florian Effenberger Florian Effenberger
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hello,

Thorsten Behrens wrote on 2011-10-27 09:45:
> I'd still suggest to suspend MC work during that time - sure, people
> can still apply for membership, and sure, MC members can send out
> receival confirmations. But since it's the very MC that is then
> standing for election, I think it is standard practice that this
> body cease to make decisions during that time.

I second that. It's not that I do not trust our MC, but I think it would
be "cleaner" if we didn't have application processing during that time.

Florian

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Florian Effenberger Florian Effenberger
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by André Schnabel
Hello,

André Schnabel wrote on 2011-10-26 21:48:

> as we have discussed previously, the paragraphs about the membership
> committee in the current statutes draft differ in some points from what
> we have in the bylaws. I hope, I can provide a translation of the
> relevant paragraphs early next week. But I want to have some discussion
> on the matter already in the first BoD meeting.

a short summary from the last call:

- For the legal set-up of the foundation, we need the elected names.
This would not happen before December 6th.

- In case we have authority approval for the foundation set-up before,
this would delay the set-up until the 6th. (NB: When we will have
authority approval is hard to predict, but more on that soon on a blogpost.)

- For the inital set-up of the foundation, the founder (German
association of FrODeV) is free to name anyone for the MC. They will of
course stick to the voting decision. As soon as the foundation is in
place, however, we have to stick to the election rules set forth in our
statues, and they foresee a 45 day advance notification period of the
elections.

- In a nutshell, this means: We either can decide to nominate the
current MC as the first MC and have a "gentlemen's agreement" that they
step back as soon as the foundation is in place, leading to new
elections about 45 days later on.

- Or we indeed wait until the current election is done and nominate
those voted on for the first MC.

Although it might mean a delay, I tend to go for the latter option. This
is much "cleaner", and as we don't know if we will have authority
confirmation before the 6th, we're basically talking about a delay of
2-4 weeks, so be it.

Thoughts?

Florian

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de-jourdain de-jourdain
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hi,

2011/10/30 Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]>

> Hello,
>
> André Schnabel wrote on 2011-10-26 21:48:
>
>  as we have discussed previously, the paragraphs about the membership
>> committee in the current statutes draft differ in some points from what we
>> have in the bylaws. I hope, I can provide a translation of the relevant
>> paragraphs early next week. But I want to have some discussion on the
>> matter already in the first BoD meeting.
>>
>
> a short summary from the last call:
>
> - For the legal set-up of the foundation, we need the elected names. This
> would not happen before December 6th.
>
> - In case we have authority approval for the foundation set-up before,
> this would delay the set-up until the 6th. (NB: When we will have authority
> approval is hard to predict, but more on that soon on a blogpost.)
>
> - For the inital set-up of the foundation, the founder (German association
> of FrODeV) is free to name anyone for the MC. They will of course stick to
> the voting decision. As soon as the foundation is in place, however, we
> have to stick to the election rules set forth in our statues, and they
> foresee a 45 day advance notification period of the elections.
>
> - In a nutshell, this means: We either can decide to nominate the current
> MC as the first MC and have a "gentlemen's agreement" that they step back
> as soon as the foundation is in place, leading to new elections about 45
> days later on.
>

IMHO, I don't see why can we not adopt this option. The current MC proved
that was (and is) impartial and deeply focused on meritocracy, essential
factors for an MC.

For me, the current MC proved that's fully deserving of this gentlemen's
agreement.

I vote for this option.

Best,

David


> - Or we indeed wait until the current election is done and nominate those
> voted on for the first MC.
>
> Although it might mean a delay, I tend to go for the latter option. This
> is much "cleaner", and as we don't know if we will have authority
> confirmation before the 6th, we're basically talking about a delay of 2-4
> weeks, so be it.
>
> Thoughts?
>
>
> Florian
>
> --
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>
> Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
> Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff
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Florian Effenberger Florian Effenberger
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hi,

David Emmerich Jourdain wrote on 2011-10-30 16:28:
> IMHO, I don't see why can we not adopt this option. The current MC proved
> that was (and is) impartial and deeply focused on meritocracy, essential
> factors for an MC.
>
> For me, the current MC proved that's fully deserving of this gentlemen's
> agreement.

I have full trust in the current MC, no doubts about that. The issue
that makes me favor the other option (wait until the new MC is in place)
is that it would avoid having elections very soon after the legal
set-up, which is rather time consuming.

Florian

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Norbert Thiebaud Norbert Thiebaud
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by de-jourdain
On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 10:28 AM, David Emmerich Jourdain
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> IMHO, I don't see why can we not adopt this option. The current MC proved
> that was (and is) impartial and deeply focused on meritocracy, essential
> factors for an MC.
>
> For me, the current MC proved that's fully deserving of this gentlemen's
> agreement.

With the caveat that Thorsten must resign as MC-deputy, since one
cannot be BoD and MC member at once.

On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 10:33 AM, Florian Effenberger
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>I have full trust in the current MC, no doubts about that. The issue that makes me favor the other option (wait until the new MC is in place) is that it would avoid having elections very soon after the legal set-up, which is rather time consuming.

Maybe we can do with the current MC as 'initially designated' for the
first 6 month of the foundation and organize a MC election then, since
it would be a good idea to have BoD election and MC election somewhat
separated to avoid 'oversight'/'membership' issues.

Norbert

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André Schnabel André Schnabel
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hi,

Am 30.10.2011 17:09, schrieb Norbert Thiebaud:
> Maybe we can do with the current MC as 'initially designated' for the
> first 6 month of the foundation and organize a MC election then, since
> it would be a good idea to have BoD election and MC election somewhat
> separated to avoid 'oversight'/'membership' issues.

Seems reasonable to me - as long as there is a substitude for Thorsten
and all of the other MC members agree to be on duty for another 6 months.

regards,

André

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sophi sophi
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hi,

2011/10/30 André Schnabel <[hidden email]>:

> Hi,
>
> Am 30.10.2011 17:09, schrieb Norbert Thiebaud:
>>
>> Maybe we can do with the current MC as 'initially designated' for the
>> first 6 month of the foundation and organize a MC election then, since
>> it would be a good idea to have BoD election and MC election somewhat
>> separated to avoid 'oversight'/'membership' issues.
>
> Seems reasonable to me - as long as there is a substitude for Thorsten and
> all of the other MC members agree to be on duty for another 6 months.

Agreed on both.

Kind regards
Sophie
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Florian Effenberger Florian Effenberger
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by Norbert Thiebaud
Hi,

Norbert Thiebaud wrote on 2011-10-30 17:09:

> With the caveat that Thorsten must resign as MC-deputy, since one
> cannot be BoD and MC member at once.

good point, indeed. Thorsten, in case you get voted as election officer,
would you step back from your MC deputy role?

Florian

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Thorsten Behrens Thorsten Behrens
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Florian Effenberger wrote:
> >With the caveat that Thorsten must resign as MC-deputy, since one
> >cannot be BoD and MC member at once.
>
> good point, indeed. Thorsten, in case you get voted as election
> officer, would you step back from your MC deputy role?
>
Hi Florian, all,

yes indeed, as a board member, I resign as Fridrich's MC deputy.

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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Michael Meeks-2 Michael Meeks-2
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by de-jourdain

On Sun, 2011-10-30 at 13:28 -0200, David Emmerich Jourdain wrote:

> > - In a nutshell, this means: We either can decide to nominate the current
> > MC as the first MC and have a "gentlemen's agreement" that they step back
> > as soon as the foundation is in place, leading to new elections about 45
> > days later on.
>
> IMHO, I don't see why can we not adopt this option. The current MC proved
> that was (and is) impartial and deeply focused on meritocracy, essential
> factors for an MC.
>
> For me, the current MC proved that's fully deserving of this gentlemen's
> agreement.

        Agreed. I too prefer this for two reasons:

        a) it -may- allow us to setup the foundation more quickly, at
           least we are not blocking on a fairly artificial timeline

        b) it adds a staggered election into the process from founding,
           such that we are not electing the MC and the Board at the
           same time - which IMHO is critical anyway

        So - I too would prefer to stick with the MC we have, and elect it
shortly after founding.

        Then again - I'm agnostic on the point; if the founding is further
delayed, perhaps having an elected initial MC in place is fine.

        ATB,

                Michael.

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Florian Effenberger Florian Effenberger
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hello,

Michael Meeks wrote on 2011-10-31 11:41:

> a) it -may- allow us to setup the foundation more quickly, at
>   least we are not blocking on a fairly artificial timeline

I think if so, it just would delay two weeks, IMHO noncritical after
this amount of time.

> b) it adds a staggered election into the process from founding,
>   such that we are not electing the MC and the Board at the
>   same time - which IMHO is critical anyway

That's indeed a very good thing.

> So - I too would prefer to stick with the MC we have, and elect it
> shortly after founding.

So, we have two choices:

1. Either vote now and have a newly voted-on MC for the legal setup.

2. Keep the existing MC and they do a gentleman's agreement to step back
by let's say June or July 1st next year.

Legally, it's no problem, since the Founder (FrODeV) simply nominates
those who should be in charge, for elections thereafter, however, the
official voting rules in the statutes are enforced.

However, for #2, we need either a replacement for Thorsten and a
decision by the BoD to go with less MC members (even with Thorsten's
replacement, the current MC only has 3 members and two deputies, but we
would need five plus two), or a more MC members.

André, can you talk to the MC tonight and see what they prefer and make
a proposal? If the BoD then votes on it, we should be good to go.

Florian

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Florian Effenberger Florian Effenberger
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by André Schnabel
Hi,

to sum things up as I have an impression they are diesred:

- We would nominate Thorsten as election officer (who then would step
back as MC deputy),
- and we would like to elect 5 members and 2 deputies in the new MC,
- and we don't want to freeze membership applications.

Please, all BoD members, cast your vote on these topics in case you
haven't yet.

What we should agree on soon is whether to run the vote just now and
wait with the legal set-up until the Foundation is in existence, or
whether we take the existing MC (needing a deputy for Thorsten, since
he's in the BoD already) and have a gentlemen's agreement that they step
back on let's say effective July 1st.

I am in favor of this solution. André, did the MC discuss that during
yesterday's call? In case we go with the July-1st-solution, all current
MC members need to agree to be willing to serve in the legal body of the
future Foundation and be mentioned in the founding documents.

I'm pushing here a bit since November 4th, on which your timeline is
based, is close.

Florian

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Olivier Hallot Olivier Hallot
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee



Em 01-11-2011 11:26, Florian Effenberger escreveu:
> Hi,
>
> to sum things up as I have an impression they are diesred:
>
> - We would nominate Thorsten as election officer (who then would step
> back as MC deputy),

+1

> - and we would like to elect 5 members and 2 deputies in the new MC,

+1

> - and we don't want to freeze membership applications.

+1

>
> Please, all BoD members, cast your vote on these topics in case you
> haven't yet.
>
> What we should agree on soon is whether to run the vote just now and
> wait with the legal set-up until the Foundation is in existence, or
> whether we take the existing MC (needing a deputy for Thorsten, since
> he's in the BoD already) and have a gentlemen's agreement that they
> step back on let's say effective July 1st.
>
> I am in favor of this solution. André, did the MC discuss that during
> yesterday's call? In case we go with the July-1st-solution, all
> current MC members need to agree to be willing to serve in the legal
> body of the future Foundation and be mentioned in the founding documents.
>
> I'm pushing here a bit since November 4th, on which your timeline is
> based, is close.
>
> Florian
>

--
Olivier Hallot
Founder, Board of Directors Member - The Document Foundation
LibreOffice translation leader for Brazilian Portuguese
+55-21-8822-8812


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Michael Meeks-2 Michael Meeks-2
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by Florian Effenberger

On Tue, 2011-11-01 at 14:26 +0100, Florian Effenberger wrote:
> - We would nominate Thorsten as election officer (who then would step
> back as MC deputy),
        +1
> - and we would like to elect 5 members and 2 deputies in the new MC,
        +1
> - and we don't want to freeze membership applications.
        +1
> we take the existing MC (needing a deputy for Thorsten, since
> he's in the BoD already) and have a gentlemen's agreement that they step
> back on let's say effective July 1st.
        +1

        :-)

                Michael.

--
[hidden email]  <><, Pseudo Engineer, itinerant idiot


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Thorsten Behrens Thorsten Behrens
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

In reply to this post by Florian Effenberger
Florian Effenberger wrote:
> - and we would like to elect 5 members and 2 deputies in the new MC,
+1

> - and we don't want to freeze membership applications.
+1 (going with the flow :))

> take the existing MC (needing a deputy for Thorsten,
> since he's in the BoD already) and have a gentlemen's agreement that
> they step back on let's say effective July 1st.
+1
 
Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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Tom Tom
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Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee

Hi :)
I have assumed that Thorsten has not stepped down from MC or something.  Whatever he was stepping down from was in order for him to be able to do some work that he is being blocked from doing anyway right?  So until the job needs to be started i think Thorsten is still on whatever it was he was going to step down from.

Sorry, i just got a bit muddled.  
Regards from
Tom :)


--- On Tue, 1/11/11, Thorsten Behrens <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Thorsten Behrens <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [steering-discuss] Preparing elections for the membership committee
> To: "Florian Effenberger" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Date: Tuesday, 1 November, 2011, 14:23
> Florian Effenberger wrote:
> > - and we would like to elect 5 members and 2 deputies
> in the new MC,
> +1
>
> > - and we don't want to freeze membership
> applications.
> +1 (going with the flow :))
>
> > take the existing MC (needing a deputy for Thorsten,
> > since he's in the BoD already) and have a gentlemen's
> agreement that
> > they step back on let's say effective July 1st.
> +1
>  
> Cheers,
>
> -- Thorsten
>
> --
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>

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